Omar M. Campbell: Let’s vote on pot

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My respect for and admiration of the Steamboat Springs Police Department only increased when I read the April 6 Steamboat Today. Capt. Joel Rae had the audacity and courage to say what a lot of us more timid folk are reluctant to talk about — banning the so-called medical marijuana industry. Increasing DUIDs and reselling by licensed users to others was predictable. Kudos also to Dr. Harrington and two other local doctors who have spoken out on the adversities of this issue in the past.

“Industry” is a handy euphemism for camouflaging and dignifying the sale of an addictive drug. I wish the Steamboat Pilot & Today would stop using that term. How about drug centers, shops, emporiums, bazaars, traders, peddlers or such?

Then the April 7 Steamboat Today contained a follow-up article discussing a public vote on banning pot. As with the Steamboat 700 annexation, this is a great proposal. Let all the people of the county decide. Like the 700 thing, this is too big and important a matter to leave to the respective majorities of the City Council and Routt County Board of Commissioners. A ban should be countywide.

Like a lot of other conservatives, I was shocked spitless in 2000 when medical marijuana was legalized in Colorado by a small majority (54 percent) of “yes” votes. I think the vote was pushed over the 50 percent mark by younger liberals who tend to come together and vote perversely on traditional or established values and issues.

The long-term strategy of the present-day “caregivers” is, of course, to eventually see pot legalized. Think of the big bucks rolling in to pot peddlers if any adult could walk in and buy it over the counter.

Let your city and county representatives know how you feel about voting on a countywide pot-selling ban; and also the mixing (infusing) of pot into candy, cookies, soft drinks, etc. — as cottage industries yet!

Omar M. Campbell

Steamboat Springs

Comments

rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Sure, circulate the petition, get the necessary signatures, then have another pointless and costly election, reaffirming what the voters have already told you. You really think there's enough rednecks in Routt to pull it off? Good luck!!

You're probably right, put the problem back in the pockets of the cartels. Prices will go down, guaranteed.

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JJ Southard 3 years, 8 months ago

70%+ voted for MMJ in Routt County.......if not more support it now... No worries, Omar. "Can't put the Genie back in the bottle" my friend.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Omar's right -- what we need is outsourcing -- it's the American way!!

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

And I can't believe this biased trash was presented in the guise of news.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Will you print my story too? Give me the byline? Put it out on the AP wire? I'll rock your socks off, probably get you a Pulitzer.

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exduffer 3 years, 8 months ago

Get a mellower strain highway. It is a letter to the editor.

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1999 3 years, 8 months ago

If we vote for allowing pot dispensaris we should also vote on alcohol dispensaries.

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1999 3 years, 8 months ago

I guess I should have worded it differently..

If we are going to vote on banning pot dispensaries we should vote on banning alcohol dispensaries.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Omar, what's your problem? Do you have a job that revolves around making money off of cannabis user busts? You work at the jail or something?

"Let all the people of the county decide. Like the 700 thing, this is too big and important a matter to leave to the respective majorities of the City Council and Routt County Board of Commissioners. A ban should be countywide."

Like JJ said, the residents of Routt county have already decided on the matter, and at over a %70 approval rating too. NO ONE left it to the City Council or the Commissioners, as it is not and never will be their decision.

Secondly.

"The long-term strategy of the present-day “caregivers” is, of course, to eventually see pot legalized. Think of the big bucks rolling in to pot peddlers if any adult could walk in and buy it over the counter."

You've figured it all out, haven't you Omar? Except, it isn't just the caregivers that want to see full legalization. I'd say that every single cannabis user on the planet wants to see it RE-legalized(important to remember that cannabis wasn't illegal until the 30's). And if you think for one second that this current prohibition is keeping all the pot peddlers from getting rich, then maybe you should take a gander at our Southern boarder? Maybe you think all of that Mexican DRUG CARTEL violence is caused by something else? Global warming or something? What do you think drives the cost of cannabis genius? Its illegality!!!! The prohibition of cannabis makes it possible for people to make money off of it in the black market. If it weren't illegal, do you think the black market for it and all of the subsequent drug cartel violence would still exist, at all?

It's impossible to believe just how far some people have allowed the wool to be pulled over their eyes. OUR FIRST PRESIDENT GREW POT PEOPLE. AND HE GREW IT FOR BUD, NOT JUST HEMP. Boy, he must have been pretty evil, huh.

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mtroach 3 years, 8 months ago

I would love to see how our tourist industry would fair if alcohol was banned. What if we vote just to ban it from use on the ski area? We all agree that skiing impaired is dangerous.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

So, the Pilot obviously has no issue with allowing articles(or letters to the editors) to be published that reflect the views of individuals that are extremely slanted and one-sided.

But what I wonder is if they'd have a problem with publishing a little something from me.

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1999 3 years, 8 months ago

well...mtroach...while I would LOVE to see it banned from the ski area.....my point is more basic.

alcohol is a purely recreational drug. (once thought to be medicinal)

If we want to claim that pot is purely recreational .....fine...so be it.

but then we will need to ban all the other recreational drugs as well.

It's just interesting to me that people have no problem with alcohol being legal as a recreational drug but get crazy about pot being a legal recreational drug.

why is that?

why is alcohol so widely accepted (and WIDELY abused)?

LETS VOTE!

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Brent Boyer 3 years, 8 months ago

mmjPatient22: Letters to the editor are precisely about reflecting the views of their authors, even if one-sided or slanted. They always appear on the opinion page of the newspaper and nowhere else. Please feel free to email your submission to me at bboyer@steamboatpilot.com. Please be aware that letters to the editor must include the author's first and last name.

Thanks, Brent

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1999 3 years, 8 months ago

Omar...doyou ever worry about how much money the alcohol distributors are making?

do you worry about the markup at bars?

B and K distrubutors probably makes a pretty penny.

budweiser? slopeside? CV Bistro?

do you worry about the alcohol peddlers making millions and millions of dollars?

alcohol is a STRICTLY recreational drug.

do you worry about their profits?

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

1999-

Be careful not to make too much sense of your argument. I've noticed that the nae-sayers tend to not respond when there's an actual well-founded debate on the table.

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trump_suit 3 years, 8 months ago

MMJ, I don't believe that the Pilot is censoring your views. At least in the online edition, your opinions are widely known. Keep is professional and please continue the fight that you beleive in.

What Omar really wants is a re-vote becuase he does not like the results of the first vote. Maybe if we vote often enough he will get what he wants. The prevailing opinion seems to be that we should limit alchohol as much or more than MMJ.

Tell us Joel Rae, when you find high school kids with illegal prescription drugs, do they look like they came from the pharmacy? When you issue a MIP does it look like it came from the liquor store? How many of those DUID's that are issued actually get prosecuted or plea bargained? Seems to me that if you read the court documents, most of them are simply dropped. Issuing a DUID is not the same as being guilty of DUID. Not supporting DUID at all but come on here a little research shows a different picture than what Capt Rae presents.

Finally for Omar, if we re-vote the MMJ issue then would complete legalization be one of the choices or do you just want to ban an activity that you do not approve of? Would you ban all music in bars because one or two of them are too noisy? Would you ban Pharmacies becuase the pills they supply are addictive and dangerous and end up in the hands of our children?

How about this little tidbit of the increasing number or newborns that start life addicted to pain pills?

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/10/us/10babies.html?hp

This issue has been voted on and the MMJ is a compromise that provides some control and monitoring over the use and supply of MMJ. When your neighbor pops a valium or a viagra to be happy do you care? Why the problem with MMJ?

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

And certainly they would cringe at the sight of all the graphs and tables that are presented at websites like;

http://www.saferchoice.org/content/view/24/53/

I mean, we wouldn't want the public to be informed of the TRUTH(backed up by all sorts of cool science and facts and stuff) that cannabis is actually SAFER than alcohol, would we? We wouldn't want to upset the establishment would we?

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

trump-

Did I recently post something that led you to believe I needed to warned about my professionalism? Granted, I'm much more emotional about this issue in real life than my posts lead on. I tame things WAY back for my 'online' edition. Not to repeat myself, but I am an ex-sailor and have been properly trained to curse as one just the same. I can assure you that my "in-person" demeanor is not as nice as I appear to be here. So, mostly, you'll just have to sit there and deal with it if you don't think that I've toned myself down enough. People in this country used to have passion about the things they believed in. People in this country used to not give a damn about being politically correct or "hurting someone's feelings." Whatever you're hung-up on, get over it.

The main thing that was getting to me is that it seems(and maybe only seems) that many more opinion articles about my beloved cannabis get published in a negative light, rather than positively. I didn't come unhinged or anything, but it is mildly frustrating when lie-based ideas and propaganda(s) are proliferated through the misinformed opinions of people like Omar. And that's why I keep popping up at these comment boards.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Funny, I thought that slam was aimed at ME. I was ready to apologize for my off-the-cuff remarks last night. I did indeed initially take this article to be news, and was somewhat miffed. Maybe editorials should be prefaced with OPINION:

It was the BEER that prompted my comments. Had I also been properly medicated, I assure you my response would have been much more profound.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

mmj: Yes, we are trying to upset the Establishment. I've made a project of it for 40 years or so. The very medium with which we are communicating at this moment, has helped enlighten the masses, as to the extent the Military-Industrial complex will go to mislead and enslave the population. I've said it before: I hope the whole regime crumbles.

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sledneck 3 years, 8 months ago

Do we really need to be "medicated" to offer "profound responses"?? Pitty.

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trump_suit 3 years, 8 months ago

No, MMJ I did not think that you were being rude or overly aggressive in your commentary. A year ago I might have had a different opinion. I did not really mean to be critical of your approach although I can see why you might have felt that way in re-reading my comment.. I was simply asking for you to continue your recent professional approach (last 6-10 months have been great)

My apologies if I offended you, that was not my intent. This discussion needs to be professional from the MMJ advocates and we need to continue to present fact based positions. The prevailing opinion among the naysayers is that MJ destroys your ability to think rationally and a hard hitting fact based approach is in my opinion the best way to combat their emotional arguments. I fully support your position on this issue.

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1999 3 years, 8 months ago

it seems from MMJ s link posted that we should also consider a ban on caffeine and caffeine dispensaries.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Caffeine, tobacco, and alcohol have all been proven to be more addictive than cannabis.

And no, I enjoy my coffee too much everyday to insinuate that it should be banned. However, I don't think that the number of Starbucks in this country is really all that necessary. Even in our town, 2 of 'em only separated by Fish Creek? Is that really necessary?

But no, none of that is the point, at all. Nice try though.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

trump-

Thanks for the clarification. I almost forgot how long I've been commenting on here and how caustic and malevolent my original jousts were with the likes of "aichempty" and other staunch opponents of cannabis. Also, thanks for the support. Not that any of this is done for the support. But it's nice to know that some of my work here is at least somewhat appreciated.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

*edneck: No, we don't "need" medication to be profound -- it just helps us be a little less rash, sometimes. And get a spell-checker, or a dictionary. Pity.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

  • is the Unix/Linux wildcard character, which matches any number of characters. Whatever fits.
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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Anyone who harbors any doubts about the FACT that cannabis remains a MAJOR cash-cow for law enforcement across the nation, take a gander at this page.

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/?q=node/53

Scroll down to some of the tables and you can see for yourself that arrests involving cannabis now account for well over HALF of almost everything that law enforcement does. Raise your hand if you think that's a better choice for our tax dollars than education reform or immigration law enforcement or even just pursuing more dangerous drugs than cannabis. Now, those of you with your hands in the air(as I'm sure there's a lot of you) are encouraged to visit this site. It points out that the total cost of the 'War on Drugs,' just for this year, has already surpassed $11 Billion dollars.

http://www.drugsense.org/cms/wodclock

There you will find all the data you could ever want to know about just how expensive it is to fight a war against cannabis, a war that no one actually believes is winnable.

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Fred Duckels 3 years, 8 months ago

This marijuana seems to have one effect on folks, they sure don't want their identity known. We now need to hire a psychiatrist to deal with the side effects. When I see the proponents man up, then I might consider that they are on to something.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Fred-

So in other words, "you cannabis users damn well ought to be afraid of the rest of us finding out who you are." Sure, that might not have been the point, but it sure makes it a lot easier to tell who's gullible enough to soak up the lies of anti-cannabis propaganda. The point is that people like you, Fred, will never be satisfied with any piece of fact or data that supports our arguments, no matter if it comes from top minds in science, law or medicine. Reckless waste, after reckless waste could be pointed out as plain as the nose on their face, but nothing will move them from their blind stance on the subject.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

And how about this Fred?

How about you actually formulate a debate on the subject, rather than take your cheap, petty little jabs from behind your big ol' "DUCKELS" name?

How about you explain the exact reasons why you think cannabis should be illegal and then back up your opinion with SOME semblance of fact or data? Why don't you tell us just how evil cannabis really is, Fred?

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

MAN UP?? My name is in the header, for all to see. I've got nothing to hide, and I'll argue facts with you all day long. Go ahead, put it to a vote -- you'll see just how outdated your reactionary politics are. Wake up and smell the coffee, Fred and sled, speaking of anonymous.

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Scott Wedel 3 years, 8 months ago

I see the basic argument is that prohibition has fundamentally failed for marijuana as it earlier failed for alcohol.

That a comparison between alcohol and marijuana consistently finds that alcohol is the more harmful substance. Alcohol is physically addicting and habit forming, mj is habit forming; long term alcohol usage damages liver functions, no such problem for mj; alcohol poisoning results in emergency room visits and deaths, no such problem for mj; and the other effects are comparable.

Thus, maybe Colorado voters knew what they were doing when we approved a constitutional amendment despite all the opponents claiming horrific consequences and that the medical part allows just about anyone to get a mmj license. Maybe the Colorado voters just wanted it to be regulated so it couldn't be given to high school students.

So now the challenge is how to regulate and deal with mj while recognizing it is comparable to alcohol. That is a particular challenge in a resort lifestyle community like Steamboat where there are so many bars and liquor stores.

Hey Fred Duckels, I used my name so now you have to man up and consider the issues.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

And what a childish thing to set-up as a prerequisite for reasonable consideration!!!

"Well, I'm not even going to think about it until so&so divulges their name! Na-na-na-boo-boo!!"

Grow up Fred.

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Fred Duckels 3 years, 8 months ago

We have a mess with drugs in this country and I don't know the answer. Legalizing everything may be the best as our libertarian friends propose. I think that a society that needs this much of an escape from reality has real problems. When I was in school the teachers explained the fall of the Roman Empire and this strikes a note of familiarity.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Wait, wait, wait...

You're comparing the current cannabis culture to the fall of the Roman Empire? Really?

How about our current economic status? What about all of the wars we're in right now? What about the fall of the dollar?

....but no, it's cannabis that's taking this country down. This just keeps getting better and better Fred. What else ya got for us?

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

The Fed is sending our children to die in foreign lands, primarily to fatten their own bank accounts. How many people died in this nation, LAST NIGHT, from hypothermia and exposure, under a bridge or in an alley, to be quietly carted off, stuck on a slab and labelled "John Doe" to never be heard from again, not even a blurb in the local rag? Do you think the Fed cares about them? Or Fred? And how much money did we waste in the Mideast during the same period, alienating even more of the world? Maybe pot smokers don't use it to escape reality, but to try and make some sense of it, with their heightened awareness, not dulled a you allege. How many of you naysayers ever even tried the stuff, huh?

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Scott Wedel 3 years, 8 months ago

Fred, We do not need to jump from regulating alcohol and mj to legalizing all drugs. Meth, cocaine, and so on are all very harmful drugs. MJ is different because it is not that harmful. We have the benefit of time and seeing people use pot for 40+ years and they are not physical or mental wrecks.

As for parallels with the Roman Empire, alcohol usage doesn't bring up parallels in your mind? Just mj? The Romans drank so much wine, but it was the drugs that led to their downfall?

Maybe accepting mj is like accepting interracial marriage and so on. Things that were once a big deal that no one sane cares about any more because there is no harm. MMJ availability has not resulted in a horrific increase in accidents, deaths or hospitalizations. In fact, crashes and fatalities have declined. MMJ is not destroying anything. The drug cartels and wasting money jailing people for mj is a far bigger problem.

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Kristopher Hammond 3 years, 8 months ago

A 54-46% margin is hardly a "small majority" in an election. In the 2000 election, 915,527 Coloradans voted in favor of Amendment 20. Bush/Cheney got 883,000 votes in the same election. Amendment 20 won by 128,544 votes. In contrast, Republican Governor Bill Owens won by only 8,297 votes in 1998, 50.3% to 49.7%. When "younger liberals" are the majority (Steamboat Springs?), they will change forever "traditional or established values and issues". Banning dispensaries takes the mmj business out of scrutiny and regulation. Be careful what you pray for.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

As I recall from History, the Roman Empire collapsed when they expanded too far. Does THIS sound familiar????

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Fred Duckels 3 years, 8 months ago

Commenting on marijuana is a sure fire way to stir the pot. In the early eighties I observed the operation and alcohol consumption of the Soviet Union and made a personal observation that they could not survive. About that time Daniel Moynahan stated that we were watching the dismantling of the soviet union. Sure enough this came to pass, as a country that strays from sound business principles is bound to fail. You can play with MJ all day long but not in my business if I know about it. I have had instances where the usage later became apparent and explained a lot of things. I have spent considerable time with individuals and later found that I was playing with a stacked deck. This has soured me on drugs. Alcohol is easier for me to spot, and I am not popular for refusing to provide them an enabling experience. I have never seen any drug or stimulant that does not have a price to pay, but I have never tried it.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

I'm trying to make sense of this argument... and if I understand it correctly, alcohol destroyed the Soviet Union. So why weren't we destroyed 150 years ago -- we've got alcohol too. In almost the same breath, alcohol is much easier to spot than marijuana. Could that be because it is much more DANGEROUS? Now they can't control themselves?

Maybe if the Russians would have had a choice, they would have occasionally opted for something a little less debilitating, and their country would have survived. We'll leave the economic arguments out of it, for the moment. The communist thing.

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Kristopher Hammond 3 years, 8 months ago

Strict Muslims do not drink alcohol at all. If Fred is correct, shouldn't Muslim nations be leaving the alcohol-drinking ones in the dust?

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Fred-

I'd say that, more precisely, commenting on cannabis when you don't have a logical thought-out argument is a great way to stir the pot. It's also a great way to get ignored because you make it clearer and clearer by the comment that you can't support your argument with any sort of fact or data. All you have is feelings, and most of those jaded by decades of propaganda, at best. "I seen it comin' when them Commies fell, I tell ya!" might suffice for a good argument where you come from, but you'll need more than that to convince me. That was the most pathetic excuse of an argument against legalization that I've ever even heard of. Valiant effort, but miserable failure.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Good point... the French, Italians, and Germans should be the next to fail.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

mmj is correct -- this argument deteriorated hours ago, with the abandonment of any semblance of form, and reverting to incoherent, irrelevant, and unrelated premises which, added together, support no conclusion whatsoever. Reason, logic, induction, deduction, premises, conclusion -- all elements in a valid debate are abandoned here, in an impassioned appeal to some emotion I cannot identify.

My attempts here have not been to dissect the opposing arguments, their form and presentation, demonstrating the invalid logic and irrelevant premises used to support equally invalid conclusions. I have rather attacked each of the premises, attempting to demonstrate its ludicrousness, thereby implicitly rendering the drawn conclusion invalid.

I have given our audience credit for the intelligence to recognize that, an assumption I may be incorrect in making. True scholars, please forgive me.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

I just re-read the opening line(s) of Omar's opinion of us evil cannabis users.

"My respect for and admiration of the Steamboat Springs Police Department only increased when I read the April 6 Steamboat Today. Capt. Joel Rae had the audacity and courage to say what a lot of us more timid folk are reluctant to talk about — banning the so-called medical marijuana industry."

Well, Omar, if there was a group of people that were speaking out against a certain part(maybe the largest part) of the way you do business (even going so far as to change the legislation regarding it, and whether or not you're allowed to do business that way) would you have the 'audacity and courage' to stand up and say something about it? It doesn't seem all that courageous to me for a cop to stand up and say something bad about cannabis. Not very courageous at all. The only significance that the April 6 article had was to show that it's starting to get hard for the cops out there that bust cannabis users as their bread&butter. So hard, in fact, that they're having to step up their anti- pro- pot game just to try to change things back to the way they were before Amendment 20.

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kevin fisher 3 years, 8 months ago

Allow me to preface my comments by writing that I am aware that each citizen of this city is entitled to his own opinions and that, right or wrong, they are all protected under the first amendment.

However, it seems that Mr. Campbell is not that well versed in the way we write laws in Colorado. "Things that are too big," like medical marijuana itself (not dispensaries), are policy issues often directed to the electorate in a referendum. Medical marijuana was such a "big issue" that, in fact, Colorado is the only state to have amended its constitution to allow for it.

The implementation of these refereneda is the responsibility of the legislative branches, on both the local and state levels. It is NOT generally the responsibility of the people to draft and enforce the pertinent rules. The voters of this state passed the aforementioned amendment 20 in 2000. The city of Steamboat Springs drafted and passed an ordinance defining the legal operation of MMC's in our town over a year ago.

Since then, I, as owner of Rocky Mountain Remedies, have been issued two annual licenses to operate an MMC by the City. This implies use by right. As such, we have invested substantial amounts of capital in the expansion of our business. We employ many people who might otherwise not have a job. We took these steps because the City said we could. To backtrack now would be unconscionable.

The time for the opponents of MMC's to speak up and be heard has passed. I recall many a night spent at council and planning meetings ironing this out. Where were they then? This is adult life and the decisions our legislators make, affect a great many people. There are no do-overs. Suck it up.

Tangentially, those of you who oppose our presence need to look at the medical marijuana model rationally. The thousand or so MMJ cardholders in the Steamboat vicinity will not stop procuring cannabis if the MMC's were to be shuttered. Instead, the demand would be shifted to the private "care-giver." No longer would the City have a say in how things are run. No longer would 150 pages of state-level rule-making and legislation be enforceable. No longer would the patients of Steamboat have a place to safely access controlled meds. No longer would law enforcement be able to "keep tabs" on the growers.

Is this what you really want? It seems like a lot of the opponents are NIMBY-types. Guess what? Close us and it will be in your backyard. You cannot take a registered patient's right to cultivate his own meds away. It is constitutionally protected.

It is time to move on. We provide a service for patients-in-need. Our relationship is triangular: physician-patient-mmc. Nowhere in this paradigm is either law enforcement's, nor a local contractor's input welcome.

Kevin Fisher Rocky Mountain Remedies

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SMRFF 3 years, 8 months ago

Right on, Kevin.

MMJ - The link you provided in one of your above posts provides what, to me, seems like very black & white, objective evidence supporting the position that marijuana is, indeed, more harmless than many drugs and even non-medicinal or recreational substances. Unfortunately, people like Mr. Campbell and Dr. Harrington are so set in their old school mindset that even cold, hard facts will not change their position.

These guys only seem to take to heart the rumors and misinformation that circulated after marijuana became illegal and can't fathom that much, if not all, of that information was based on false information and misperceptions.

If hard data (i.e. FACTS) is not convincing enough, I don't know what will be. You could show these guys a globe and satellite image of the earth, and they'd still be convinced that the earth is flat.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

SMRFF-

And that's what it's all about. It's one of my missions in this life to debunk and unseat the lies that helped initiate the prohibition of cannabis almost 80 years ago. The only way to fight the lies, and win, is by using the truth. The truth is the mightiest weapon that we have and there's nothing that any of the nae-sayers can do or say that can tarnish that truth. Some people are more comfortable with lies and disinformation. Those people are normally beyond help, and like you implied, you couldn't tell 'em it was wet outside even if it was raining. Nonetheless, I'll always outstretch an umbrella of truth, even to the stubborn ones.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Praise this medium, the Internet, which has helped dissolve the library of misinformation to which we had previously exposed. Now the truth is unregulated, ready for all to see. To those who are truly curious, and not swayed by their conditioned biases. It has already worked wonders in the Middle East, and Ethiopia, and continues to, as we speak. Let it continue to enlighten the masses, in forums such as this, unrestrained. The Internet is the greatest instrument of knowledge ever devised, ironically as a military project, to begin with. Now we are all equal, right here. Ya gotta love it!!

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

I've always loved how quiet it gets on these comment boards when everyone gets a nice, big, fat dose of cold, hard truth.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

When pot helped me understand COBOL, man's laws became suddenly irrelevant.

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hereandthere 3 years, 8 months ago

In perfect ageement with you YVB! (Can hardly believe it). Besides YVB's most excellentg post, and others, how about the good old American values of personal liberties?

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Fred Duckels 3 years, 8 months ago

Where do I get the idea that we are being bullied?

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Fred-

That's a hell of a question. And if I had to venture a guess as to why you might be feeling so 'bullied," as you so succinctly put it, I would have to assume that it can't feel very nice when you can't formulate a reasonable debate. Time and again the cannabis users, such as myself, that care enough to get on here and straighten out the lies of the cannabis prohibition have put forth factual argument after factual argument. And then we wait.... And it seems like we're always left waiting.

But if you'd really like to chat about bullying, maybe it's worth bringing up the FACTS(again, sorry about all those) about how cannabis became illegal in the first place? What would you call a bunch of industrialist, big business guys getting together and initiating a campaign to demonize, and subsequently outlaw, cannabis as something that wreaks unspeakable horrors upon those that ill-fatedly choose to indulge in it? Well, lets see here...rich industrialists + a plant that threatens their business(es) + a little racism(just to make sure everyone is properly divided amoungst themselves) = bullying the people around into believing that the only way they'll be safe is to outlaw a PLANT.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

That was just the start. That quickly became What's that thing? (dang, plain sight -- what a stoner...) Put your hands on the hood. Spread your legs, and put your hands behind your back. Where did you get this stuff? You have the right to remain silent. Motion denied. Objection overruled. 6 months; this is just like you were drunk, and it ain't the first time. You are a menace to society. All for smoking the devil weed.

Who's the bully now? Do you test prospective employees? If so, you are a bully too.

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

I had sorta hoped he had switched sides to the ones who are being bullied.

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Fred Duckels 3 years, 8 months ago

I hope that marijuana is good for high blood pressure. The community has had huge investments to build a class resort and this pot shop environment and accompanying sleaze can nullify much of the effort. I don't have a dog in the fight but I prefer an image free of this atmosphere. That's my vote.

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Scott Wedel 3 years, 8 months ago

So the historic easy availability of drugs and alcohol in a resort town was a good thing that built this resort, but mmj dispensaries will be the ruination of SB?

And people complain about an anti-business atmosphere in SB and then also complain about certain businesses. RMR has spent a lot of money on contractors to make their grow facilities, pay a lot of rent to local commercial property owners and so on. Dispensaries generate at least $100K in sales tax revenue for the City. Do we really want to shut down businesses because it annoys a few people?

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

He's on the ropes. folks. Punch-drunk, and swinging wildly. A few more solid blows, maybe he'll go down. Maybe we should discuss this over a joint.

Yet again, we see ludicrous premises, leading to an illogical conclusion. Yeah, those parking-lot parties at RMR can get pretty wild. The neighboring warehouses are in an uproar. Do you even know where RMR IS, Fred?

My BP was 116/82 last week, heart rate 64 -- immediately after smoking a cigarette. I turned 56 the other day. Ask your doctor how this old guy is doing. Pot ain't hurting me.

I was at a wild pot party last week, and I heard some news: Recent research has revealed that the world IS flat. Why don't you go find the edge for us, Fred?

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Fred Duckels 3 years, 8 months ago

rhys, You are a stud, how many teeth do you have, and which direction is closer to the edge?

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

Please pardon my sudden lack of patience. Some recent blood in my stool, a visit to the local VA hospital, then them moving my next appointment ahead 3 months, upon receiving the lab results, has all this seeming rather trivial right now. I trust my more rational comrades will carry on the debate without me. Cheers.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Fred-

Actually cannabis is something that lowers blood pressure. I'd tell you to go do your own research on the subject but people like you usually aren't interested in the truth, as we've already covered that.

And the only thing I can tell you about how much you THINK cannabis has tarnished this city's image is, well maybe you should've gotten out more in protest of Amendment 20.
Bear in mind that not a SINGLE cannabis user has ever put a gun to the head of someone else and said, "here, smoke this or die."

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freerider 3 years, 8 months ago

Fred

why are you in this debate when you should be out making sure your job sites are safe and nobody is going to get killed !!

go away

ignorance and arrogance go hand in hand with you

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

This is a great article for those that are interested in the subject(and no Fred, I'm not talking to you):

http://www.actionamerica.org/drugs/wod-pt1.shtml

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SMRFF 3 years, 8 months ago

Some people are just fresh out of common sense. Seriously, there is not one single remotely valid argument for the continued prohibition of marijuana. There is a plethora of conclusive evidence that marijuana carries with it minimal physical and societal risk.

The continued battle against legalization is based on outdated, subjective "data" and some old school, good ol' boy fear mongering. The evidence people like Omar, Capt. Rae and Dr. Harrington provide to support their prohibitive stance is about as vague as the warnings on every single prescription bottle - "May cause drowsiness", "May impair ability to operate heavy machinery", etc, etc. Duh. Pretty much anything we ingest might have a side effect or two.

My favorite is the "gateway drug" argument. This has been disproven over and over, yet people still resort to that if all else fails. I also like the "I don't want a bunch of lazy stoners walking around my streets" argument. That one seems popular among the older conservatives and religious zealots.

Given what many of the above posts say, I think I'm preaching to the choir here, but sometimes it's the easiest way to vent.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

SMRFF-

You seem to have it figured out pretty good. Your(our, if you will) position on cannabis is well received by more than half of us, at least. I would think that the vote on Amendment 20 and a mere walk around the streets with some of the other locals would be enough to convince anyone of the fact that cannabis is NOT destroying any part of any society, contrary to what the nae-sayers would have us believe. I'm not too sure that the world will ever be rid of all of the people who choose to authoritatively attempt(albeit an exercise in futility) to assert their will/feelings over those that choose cannabis, but it sure is nice to think about. However, as we've both stated, the battle wages on. Personally, I wholeheartedly believe that society is at a breaking point, and not just here in the good ol' US of A. Tax paying peoples of all nations can no longer afford to support the salaries of those that cherish their war against cannabis. It is also my wholehearted belief that, for the most part, people are smart enough to see through the lies and the flat-out bull$#!+ that serve as the foundation for the war against cannabis. I'd re-post the dozen, or so, links that I'm aware of that contain FACTS about how beneficial cannabis can be for a person(not to mention industry, jobs and economy), but everyone here is either already aware of the truth or has no interest in it whatsoever.
So, what I propose is, it's high time that a much more substantial vote be held, in a not too distant election. It's time for the people to stand up and demand that the war against cannabis be stopped. Not just in the name of medicine, but completely 100% stopped cold in its tracks. It's time to repeal the prohibition of cannabis and relegate its memory to the pages of history. We, as people and individuals, are way too intelligent to believe and/or accept the lies anymore. We have moved beyond this kind of prejudice in almost every other facet of our civilization. A lot has been accomplished by groups of people demanding legislation that further acknowledges that ALL people have a right to vote, be heard and be free, regardless of color, sex, creed, etc... Slavery abolished. Women vote. Children get labor laws and mandated education. Prohibition of alcohol repealed.

We have accomplished too much in the name of humanity to allow this VAST injustice to carry on further. But when is 'enough' really going to be enough?

Why can't we band together and legislate the outlawing of those that persecute cannabis users? Make it a felony to bust a cannabis user. That seems about fair.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

....and to drive the point home just a little further....

For those of you that relentlessly cling to your faith in "modern medicine" and pharmaceuticals at a doctor's orders, what exactly do you think makes your doctor so high&mighty about the medicine that he practices? They've got every confidence in the world that they hold the cure to your ails, regardless of what they are. "Here's a prescription for __. I want you to take these 3 times a day, with food. Side effects may include ________. Call me if anything unusual occurs."

And if you think, for a second, that they're simply in it to make you 'healthier' or help you live longer, you've got quite another thing coming. Here's 25 facts that prove they're just in it for the money.

http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/25-shocking-facts-that-prove-that-the-entire-u-s-health-care-industry-has-become-one-giant-money-making-scam .

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

My brother died at 48 because he took prescription drugs most of his life. Liver cancer, then cancer everywhere. He was an attorney, and a light drinker. I looked in his medicine cabinet once. One side had the usual -- toothbrush, razor, shaving cream, etc. The other side was chock full of prescriptions, 4 rows. Antihistamines, decongestants, pain pills -- he had allergies, and had some dental work done. Most doctors think they're God, the cure for all ills. Once you step in their office, you become a statistic, a subject in an experiment. I should have called every physician on his prescriptions, to let them know how the experiment came out. Their miracle drugs are like shotguns: They may hit the target, but what else do they hit?

I won't touch man-made drugs since, not even aspirin. But if YOU want to, I say Go for it!!

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Scott Wedel 3 years, 8 months ago

Saw Sheriff Wiggins at OC Town Board meeting.

He read a letter from an US Attorney to the city of Oakland Ca saying how marijuana is against the law and so on. And said that was a reason to not allow it in Oak Creek.

Of course, that letter was striped of its context because Oakland is considering allowing 5 grow centers of 50,000 sq ft each that could supply 20% of the total mmj for California and California only allows nonprofit collectives to operate dispensaries. Thus, it is plausible to wonder exactly how Oakland's plan could conform to California state law. And so the letter from the US Attorney is saying that the feds are not going to debate with Oakland whether Oakland's plan technically follows state law. That the feds can always act based upon mj growing and selling violating federal law.

But that letter does not change the feds policy of allowing mmj that conforms to state and local laws. It is stating that it is still their discretion whether or not to bust operations and they do not need any judge's ruling or such to declare some operation to be acting contrary to state law.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Scott-

Point in case. Thank you for yet another fine example of law enforcement fighting to keep their "right" to bust(and make money off of) cannabis users.

Really the only thing that they're ever looking for is a lead. Give 'em something to go off of and they're hot on the trail. Granted, if it's some small timer they'll probably not make a big fuss about it. But if there's any sort of grandeur to the operation, be it large scale or high publicity or highly lucrative, they'll move in with all that they've got at their disposal. Warrants issued, flash bangs deployed, records seized, people hand-cuffed, criminal records lengthened and lots&lots of prosecution/imprisonment money to be made. After all, there ARE numerous salaries to be payed here.

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freerider 3 years, 8 months ago

Wiggins

Joel Rae

Omar Campbell

All protecting corporate profits in the drug trade . these medieval fools display there ignorance everytime one of them opens their piehole

They are also protecting cartel profits by their foolish arrogance when it comes to MMJ

When will the U.S.A. evolve out of the dark ages ??

Chiropractors went to jail at one time because of the AMA

The Earth was flat

Alcohol & Nicotine kill Thousands

Broken record here

DEATH FROM MARIJAUNA = ZERO EVER IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD !!!

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

When the last of the ruling generation dies off, then we will evolve. Prescriptions, anyone?

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rhys jones 3 years, 8 months ago

If the people vote in the same proportion they contribute to this forum, I don't think there will be much of a contest. The naysayers are dropping like flies. Got any more for us?

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freerider 3 years, 8 months ago

Hey Fred , Omar , Wiggins , Rae this reminds me all you freking ignorant rednecks

Fun little quote's from Harry Anslinger our drug czar 1937 Hitler would have loved this guy

“There are 100,000 total marijuana smokers in the US, and most are Negroes, Hispanics, Filipinos, and entertainers. Their Satanic music, jazz, and swing, result from marijuana use. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers, and any others.”

“…the primary reason to outlaw marijuana is its effect on the degenerate races.”

“Marijuana is an addictive drug which produces in its users insanity, criminality, and death.”

“Reefer makes darkies think they’re as good as white men.”

“Marihuana leads to pacifism and communist brainwashing”

“You smoke a joint and you’re likely to kill your brother.”

“Marijuana is the most violence-causing drug in the history of mankind.”

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jack legrice 3 years, 8 months ago

Well Fred you should not be telling someone to go check their job site. Did you forget that you had a fatality on your job site? Then had the nerve to contest the small fine given you. And you don't smoke pot. What is wrong with this picture!!!!

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Today being tax day, I think it's more appropriate and relative than most any other day of the year to remind people of just how many of their tax dollars are being flushed down the tubes in the pursuit of non-violent cannabis users.

http://www.drugsense.org/cms/wodclock

At the time when I posted this link, it only read that $11,967,865,142 had been spent on fighting the war on drugs(over 50% of which is still wrapped up in cannabis), so far this year in federal and state totals.

How many millions of dollars more does the clock currently read? Find out, click it. At a rate of over $500 a second, who knows.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

Oh, and PS...

So far this year, over 250,000 people have been arrested on cannabis related charges. There haven't even been a half of a million people arrested in total drug arrests so far this year.

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mmjPatient22 3 years, 8 months ago

When's the last time we had an actual "fact" from the naysayers?

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