Oak Creek airs police grievances

Residents, businesses start petition citing complaints about increased enforcement

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— Disgruntled Oak Creek residents and business owners have begun circulating a petition enumerating complaints against the Oak Creek Police Department, whose "big city" mentality is being blamed for hurting business in their small town.

"The gist of the petition is that the increased law enforcement presence in Oak Creek has decreased the business patronage," said Police Commissioner Chuck Wisecup. Wisecup and co-commissioner Dave Fisher are scheduled to meet with the town attorney Monday to discuss the petition.

"What they're claiming is that our presence has hurt business in town, that no one wants to come to Oak Creek," Police Chief Russ Caterinicchio said.

Colorado Bar owner Becky Elliott, who authored the petition, gathered about 60 signatures by approaching people - and has since acquired four more pages from people who have approached her wanting to sign.

"So many people are complaining about the Police Department, and it wasn't getting through to anyone that we have a problem," Elliott said. "Our numbers are down - something has to be done.

"I heard quite a few people saying they're going around town, taking (Routt County Road) 14, so they don't even have to worry about being hassled by the police," Elliott said.

Historically, this is at least the third time that such petitions have been started in town, Caterinicchio said.

"This is sort of normal for some residents of Oak Creek - when they have a police department that actually does something and enforces the laws, they get angry," Caterinicchio said. "If people are driving under the influence or driving around without license plates, it's our duty to stop them."

This week's public forum to discuss police issues in Oak Creek predates the recent petition, which began circulating about two weeks ago. The Town Board requested the forum, scheduled for 7 p.m. Wednesday, as part of a public outreach and education effort by the Police Department, Wisecup said.

"All members of the community are invited to share concerns and grievances," Caterinicchio said.

"We have a vocal minority and silent majority that you don't typically hear from. Hopefully, we'll hear from both," Wisecup said.

The Oak Creek Police Department sent out a survey to all residents Feb. 5, to gather information to direct community policing efforts and provide figures for grant applications. The survey asks residents about public safety, including asking them to rank issues of concern, perceived quality of life in Oak Creek and crime prevention measures locals are taking.

"Hopefully, we'll get some valuable input about people's perception of the police," Wisecup said.

Under Oak Creek's existing complaint process for police, concerned parties can file a written complaint at Town Hall, which is reviewed by the police chief or the police commissioners. Of all complaints received since Caterinicchio came on board last fall, all have been found to be without merit, he said.

"It's a serious matter, but there's nothing for my officers to be worried about since they've done nothing wrong," Caterinicchio said. "I haven't lost a minute's sleep over it because I truly believe that we do what people want us to do."

However, disgruntled locals are tired of being subject to "big city" policing, Elliott said.

"It's not like we have bank robbers and murderers here, but that's how they go about it," Elliott said. "We have our problems, but they're not like the city."

- To reach Melinda Dudley, call 871-4203

or e-mail mdudley@steamboatpilot.com.

Comments

Malcolm_Reynolds 6 years, 10 months ago

I really missed the soap operas of Oak Creek this brings back the Cargo days.

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

Cheif Russ is doing a wonderful job. Take a look at the whiners complaining against him. Recognize them from the jail reports? D.U.I? Drugs? No wonder their upset. Why would they want someone that enforces the law and treats everyone equally. Get real Oak Creek the days of the rogue group of thugs ruling over everyday innocent people is over. Chief Russ was a Messianic Jewish Rabbi that fellowships and visits all religions. This person is driven to care ,respect,protect and teach about how to love thy neighbor as thy self. He is driven by a higher power. So forget the past techniques of cruelty inflicted on Oak Creek officers who cared and tried to nurture those with issues,who were the first ones there at your loved ones accident to hold there hand while the ambulance was in route,to answer the call in the middle of the night when the relative beat your silly head in, in anger, remember the law is not the enemy. You are your own worst enemy. Grow up. If you can not live in peace leave Oak Creek and move to out of state areas that are secluded where thuggery exists. No longer will the rest of Routt county allow you to intimadate the quiet ones in O.C. In the past a few loud mouths in O.C. tried to intimidate any one else who dared to step up. With much prayer for this Man of G-d many stand behind him. We will be stepping up to the plate to insure the meek this time have a free word and that everyone in O.C. is allowed to enjoy their mountain home without the constant unwarranted turmoil. No one I know of is avoiding O.C. businesses. Matter of fact most are looking forward to the new Judys donut shop that does not sell liquor.The only avoidance I know of is the Mugshot when the liquor license goes thru Feb.14. The Mugshot is a good bakery but would loose its family character with alcohol. What a negative. Its a shame.

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ColoradoNative 6 years, 10 months ago

I'd be curious to know how many OC business owners have signed on considering there just aren't that many.

With 60 signatures it seems there is a real issue at hand.

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nondescript1 6 years, 10 months ago

Ahhh.... nothing really changes in Oak Creek does it? It makes a nearly perfect circle time and again.

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candylane 6 years, 10 months ago

What do you mean that you are not posting anonymously Tim! Just because people figured out your "sign in" name does not mean that you are post anonymously. No one griped and complained more than you, so the initials were enough to give you away! You were the one that made it so by answering back! How would you know if the food is bad now or are you going by when you were the cook! You are not even in Routt County so it would be hard for you to be a verifieable food critic of the present food!

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tmac62 6 years, 10 months ago

candylane iam in routt county and have talk with alot of peole that have eaten at the colorado hell the food sucked when i cooked there how many people do you know go by tmac

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

That says a lot for your expertise as a cook! Not so much as a critic. When were you in there to eat or drink lately since you are not allowed in there? It is hard to be a proper critic, using someone else's taste buds! This blog is about town employees not town businesses. If you don't live in Oak Creek, and don't spend your money here, it really is not your business. Since you know how bad the food was when you were the cook, and by your standards it has remained the same, how are they still in business? This is not about "your definition" of the quality of the food, but the quality of Oak Creek! Put up or shut up!

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tmac62 6 years, 10 months ago

iam still waiting on the restrainiing orders that you talk about if you want to eat good food dont eat in oak creek

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

Sour Grapes! There is a lot of good food in Oak Creek. Your taste buds are by someone else's standards. Have you even been to (Pisa's) Black Mountain or Fortunes. Both are under new management and are great. Fortune has some of the best sandwiches in the county and the new atmoshere is out of the world!

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tmac62 6 years, 10 months ago

ok iam being the ass my beef is with the colorado and ther owners iam sorry to have pissed anyone off by the way i do live in routt

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justathought 6 years, 10 months ago

All I can say is I hope those that have signed a petition or attend the meeting to complain actually have first hand knowledge this time and are not just accepting other peoples account of events....again.

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

If we don't see your face at the meeting, then we know that you are not really concerned about Oak Creek. That must mean you just want to bitch without a face! You could send a letter to the meeting and sign your name, if you can't attend. If there are no restaining orders or warrents (tmac), then there is no reason for you not to be there. Since you don't work, there is no reason for you not to be there

For those driving up 14, are you afraid there is a warrant or are under the influence. In that case, we really don't want you driving through Oak Creek anyway.

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Tricia Nickerson 6 years, 10 months ago

How come no response to my post of The Holy Name Church big in STEAMBOAT. A nice St Michael's in OAK CREEK. No one wants to discuss the churches available. How about some FAITH for our youngsters. HOPE AND LOVE. Can you feel it?

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upstream 6 years, 10 months ago

As for the business owners who signed the petition- Shame on each and every one of them. A simple bit of research demonstrates that sales are NOT down in Oak Creek. Sales tax revenue is up this month compared to this month last year as well as the three months previous.

J and Becky are such righteous capitalists one would think they would look into this before starting such a petition- not to mention take a long hard look at the reasons THEIR business may be down. Hmmm...Let's see...sky rocketing heating costs making us all save our pennies, the heaviest snow winter in ages making it hard for folks to get out and about, breakfast that can take an hour to reach the table, a nation stumbling headlong into a massive recession...just a few ideas.

As for the "let's get rid of the police" stuff- raise your hand if you are a veteran of this whole saga. This is exactly how Cargo-ville came to be- and here we are 7 years later having the same stupid conversation. J Elliott sat on the board with Cargo and served as her police commissioner. Together they seemed to believe only they could choose an acceptable cop. All others were run out of town at the end of a sharp stick with no public hearings so we will never know FACT from whipped up rumor and innuendo.

Is anyone else starting to see a little Cargo coming through in Jay's recent actions? Do we suppose he may be thinking of starting to dismantle our weak mayor system the way she did? Is anyone else shocked and disgusted at his obvious conflict of interest here...bar owner...rabble rouser...mayor?

Becky, J and all who signed this absurd petition...if Oak Creek were to become the town in Northwest Colorado no one dares to speed through and no one dares to drink and drive in and no one dares to cook or sell meth in, I'd be right proud of my Oak Cretian identity. Oh and- TFB about your business losses: I'm still mourning the loss of several young lives to alcohol, drugs and a lack of suitable role models.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Upstream -- you have done your research, used common sense in this post, and are right on target! Thank you.

It's time the silent majority in Oak Creek step up to the plate and for once not be intimidated by this group.

It's also quite interesting how this is all coming about just before elections in April -- shades of what went on a few years ago when former mayor Rodeman took over. And look where that got Oak Creek -- nearly bankrupt, no competent police department, and years of "controversial" news coverage -- Oak Creek -- HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN?

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

Now would be a good time for Oak Creek folks to consider what qualities in leadership are unfavorable and cause repeative failures that target authority such as the Police Dept. The most obvious is first allowing leadership postions that handle citizens money or who make decisions that effect lives of citizens to perform in that position without a drug test and background check. The Friday night bar stool line up should not be the same people that in that same seating arrangement sit and make rules in Town Hall and direct where all your hard earned monies go. Where are the missing funds? The Police Dept. conducts thorough background checks and of course drug tests.They are the most honest, reliable group. Very few of the others work in outside employment that conducts these tests.

How to avoid Oak Creeks past phrase"Where did all the money go"by looking at mistakes from other small towns nationwide.

1.Characteristics that were learned in the past to avoid: a. A leader that lines up friends that have all the same habits. The group is not diverse. No one questions the leader. b. Awkwardly the supporting articles in the paper such as comments sent in almost look like there written by the leader and the leaders kids. The general feel of the comments tries to intimidate anyone for ever questioning authority of the leader. Publically any and all attacks are loudly and embarrassingly jabbed. How dare any homeowner thats not on the bar team step up. c. The public that supports drugs loves having a leader that will appear to protect their interest, but start to notice the leader seems to be secretly up to no good. Revenue seems good but some how the balance sheet is messed up. The town is always shy of funds. Strangely funds are removed from backup accounts to fill the sustainable funds account. d. No drug test or background check was ever performed on the leader or the bar seat team members. It was talked about and most of the public assumed it was done solely by looking at the few respectable members who absolutely were tested and hold high ranking employment in outside fields. e. Eventually almost everyone in town is nervous. The leader becomes almost mental and holes up in the office. Even the leaders closest coke snorters can not access financial records that were once open to their little club. f. In fear the little town of mostly good hard working family units is left with no leader and in the hole. It takes years to recover. The towns people are gouged to death with taxes on everthing. They can't even recieve electricity without the delving of a middle man. All this because the towns leadership foundation was built on enforcing no law enforcement.

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

knowitall. Just wondering what kind of business you have for sale? Also unless I'm wrong the museum is open several days weekly.And the price of rentals is dependent on supply and demand, not on the price of gas. I think local gas station tries to keep their price down.but they can't do any thing about the cost to them. And I really don't think the donut shop is just for Chief Russ and the boys,Whats wrong with them taking their break there (if it ever gets opened) I would love to have a donut shop here. I'd probably be there about every morning, And what does Oak Creek have to offer? Have you ever stopped and looked around? We have bars for the drinking and socializing, we have a skating rink for the active, we have a library and a book store for the readers, we have 6 places to eat' we have the museum, we have a dance studio, we have a antique store(Brand spanking used) We have a stained glass shop, we have a mail order store (Soda Creek),A tile and granite shop, we have a garage you can get your car fixed at, a flower shop, two furniture factorys , a highend furniture store , a convience store, All kinds of extra curricular activies at the schools, a bank and a medical center. We have a couple of churches, a couple of nice laundromats, a youga center, a hair/nail/tanning salon, a tatto parlor, a liquor store/movie rental/sporting goods store,a exercise/tumbling studio, and a bike shop. I'm sure I have missed quite a few places to go and do stuff , And whats our population ?? between 600 and 800?, Oh and we have an active police dept, too !And a darned good Fire and Ambulance Dept , Pretty good for a tiny town, HUH ??? IN MY OPINION

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ColoradoNative 6 years, 10 months ago

Is this the post where Mr. Knowitall reveals himself?

drum roll.............

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

Muskno... I agree, there should be more warnings given, before actual tickets ,especially for young drivers, I think it would be great if Chief Russ or whoever we have as police officers to have a class at school to show young drivers movies of accidents, explain that if the speed limit signs say 25 miles an hour thats what it means, not 30 or 35. I hear him ( CHIEF Russ at school meeting with the school oficials, well maybe kids could be included in some discussions. When I was in school we had assemblys with questions and answers . Maybe he could form a better repoire with the kids

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upstream 6 years, 10 months ago

nmyopinion you've hit the nail on the proverbial head here. Time to start showing your Oak Creek pride (and that would not be by referring to ourselves as a "small drinking town with a hunting and fishing problem" as j and Becky's T-shirts read). Support our local businesses and, just as importantly, support the actively participating men and women of our town council- these are OUR people and they are doing more hard work than most of us realize. Let's make our kids proud of who we are, eh?

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

Seven are you saying that now to be an elected official in Oak Creek you need to be fingerprinted, drug tested and a complete background check done! From what I have heard in the past, it is hard to get qualified people to step up to the plate andrun for an office. The town letter said, if someone wanted to run, all they had to have was a town form with ten signatures from registered "in town" voters. How many people have you heard knocking on your door for votes or signatures. It takes a dedicated person to want to be beat up on a weekly basis to run for an office in Oak Creek. I'm sure that they know what ever is in their closet will be exposed soon enough, so let us add a little more red tape to encourage those brave souls to get out there and run! I don't care who you are, everyone has a skeleton or two hanging around to come back and haunt them. Even Obama's coke days came back to haunt him!

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

Fantastic to see the beginning of O.C. citizens finally getting serious about winning the town back .

Here are some suggestions to consider:

-Watch for any possible drug sales or manufacturing and call Crime Stoppers at 870-6226. They never ask your name and all info is confidential. -Some signs for manufacturing are severe acne or crators on face or hands.The chemicals are so toxic while standing over the cook pots it starts to eat the skin. Facial discoloration. Funny chemical odor next door probably more late at night while most are sleeping. Hauls little bags of trash to car alot even though they could just put in their own trash can outside. -Users teeth can be black or rotted if mostly meth or even hardly no teeth visible. Various drugs can cause folks to never sleep. They may brag about not sleeping for days. Visually they seem nervous and sometimes can be a little twitchy. - Prefer 2 dogs to alert them over 1 dog in case the other misses any noises. This protects the stash of course. -Seem to get alot of company that only stays breifly. -Talks mostly in bar situations about their hatred of any law enforcement. The funniest one locally and maybe I should not say it but was the lady years ago complaining about getting a DUI and while complaining was snorting cocaine off the bar. -Watch closely for the drunks that stagger out of the bars and make the choice to drive drunk knowing they are rolling killers. They give considerate folks that drink responsibly a bad image. Call the Sheriffs office at the non-emergency line of 879-1090. -A pattern locally has been issues with the early drinkers. They seem to work very little and are struggling with alcoholism. By night they leave the bar in very poor condition. -Insist officers are allowed to be watching bar areas until OC gets back in line.Your very life may depend on it . -Currently there are some dedicated, law abiding citizens that serve the Town well but what about the rest? Make sure to vote in good people. None of us are perfect,however placing people in the position over your money matters. -Take a firm stand anytime some thug bashes the Police Dept. In reality the Police Dept. is the only one dedicated to protecting you. A stand against those folks tells the thugs we are not bright enough and there for thugs can easily over come the Town. -Mostly remember any info at all helps Crime Stoppers. It is the springboard and starting point to rid yourselves of the thug baggage in Oak Creek.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Through all of the rattle on the post the only two people that seam logical and reasonable are seven and upstream. You are right on!

Regardless of what anyone cares to admit (I realize that MOST of the residents in OC do not fit the profile), but OC has a reputation of being a town of drunks and stoners.

I have seen it in Oak Creek for the past 35 years (and I am sure it went on before then)... when any law enforcement comes into town that actually tries to make it a better place to live the bar flies, hippies and stoners either push them out or find other ways to paralyze their efforts.... this is just one more attempt.

Personally, I have empathy with Chief Russ; he has a lot of history to overcome. Could he give more warnings... probably; but would it make people notice that it is not all right to drive 40 on city streets (including Main)... I would think that the drunks stumbling out of the bars would appreciate that one... he is trying to keep you from getting kiled by a car coming through town. No offense to anyone, but having grown up here no real good comes from being out after curfew.

I was personally excited about the thought and reality of Sierra View... too bad the price point is so high relative to the neighborhood around it. It was doomed to fail from the beginning.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Since Oak Creek is a special place in our hearts, we took the time to go down and meet Chief Russ. He was very cordial, gave us a tour of the OCPD, went over the goals he and the Town Board are trying to help Oak Creek reach, and we were pleasantly surprised at the accomplishments that have been made in just a few months. Is there room for a little more understanding of the locals? Perhaps. It all takes time to get settled in and to assess your surroundings. We were quite surprised also at the business owners who did sign the petition -- not based on actual experiences themselves, but on "I heard...he/she said" etc. We have friends in Oak Creek who own businesses, and they were completely unaware of this petition until the newspaper article came out -- perhaps this was a "selective" petition. Also, several signatures by alleged locals were unreadable.

There is that very vocal minority in any small community who ALWAYS feel they're being singled out -- wouldn't it be better to accept responsibility for one's actions rather than try to plunge Oak Creek into another divided battle ground?

Chief Russ and the Board are trying to improve the quality of living for the MAJORITY of Oak Creek residents. We all need to see the big picture here, not just what's happening "for the moment." Change is sometimes difficult to accept.

SUGGESTION: Give this department a chance -- the doors are being opened to the public for better communication -- attend these forums and meetings and become an active, positive participant in what goes on in your community.

There are usually two sides to the story, and the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

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aufait 6 years, 10 months ago

Some of the unreasonable local offenses (ticketed and not ticketed)!

Buying candy bar at laundry mat at 10 pm Buying a soda at 5 am Is your hair dyed Throwing snowballs Not coming to complete stop at 2 am Jaywalking Hitch hiking inside of Oak Creek city limits Riding around town at midnight Driving a car (married daughters) that is not owned by yourself Driving through Oak Creek

The police in Oak Creek do not care about the local codes, only what is told to them by the town board / employees to do. They are making up their own laws as they go, and usually it is when someone is by their selves with out a witness. If you are by yourself they are hateful, not out to protect and serve as one would think.

The Steamboat Police blotter has some out landish calls, that bloggers occasionally make light of, Oak Creek also needs a blotter.

Oak Creek has only had two types of police. Either they were authoritative or permissive! Just like in parenting that doesn't work. They need to find a middle ground or authorititive. One is what is referred to as the Jellyfish, where anything goes. The other is the Brick wall, where there's a rule for everything. And the third is the Backbone that works the best because it mixes flexibility with limit setting.

Chief Russ and Erick are not authoritative because when you point something out like there are no crosswalks or that is not a code, their response is foul language, and or losing their cool or they don't care what the codes are that is what they and or the board decided to do! Which in turn would make them the law breakers!

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Timberline 6 years, 10 months ago

I have lived in Oak Creek almost all my life, and I've seen many Police Departments come and go. Some of them good and some of them not so good. I think our current one is an example of not so good. They have potential, but were not a big city and they need to get rid of that mentality. They just need to take a class on small town people skills. We are a small community that chose to live here and raise our families, because it is a beautiful place to live. We work hard and pay our taxes and support our familes and local businesses. Not all of us break the laws by speeding or driving drunk. There is nothing wrong with going out to the bars as long as you have a designated driver or walk home. If you break the law you deserve to face the consequences, but not all Oak Creek citizens are drunks or druggies. That's just my opinion!

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Timberline 6 years, 10 months ago

colorado123: Yes, I did fill out the survey and half of the questions were ridiculous, but i sent it in anyway. I will be at the meeting Wednesday to make some suggestions, and voice my opinion, and that's what it will be "My opinion & my suggestions". I personally have not read the petition, nor did I sign it, but I'd like to read it. I was responding to the posts that had been written here.

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upstream 6 years, 10 months ago

hate to be an over poster- but i do want to clarify that it was not nmyopinion's post suggesting more "warnings" I was agreeing with, rather the previous one laying out all this little town has to offer if you just look. As for the "warnings" biz- I personally learned as a teenager with nearly enough infractions to cost me my license and ALL respect from my family, that the speed limit signs ARE your warnings and the laws ARE the laws regardless of how cute, clever or hooked up and important you think you are (talking about my own ignorant youth here, but if the shoe fits, any of you can wear it too (-: ). And as for aufait's list of absurd infractions- reminds me of the oversimplifications and pubescent cries of ," Wah! UNFAIR! Teacher's picking on me!" I've been treated to by middle schoolers over the years. There is always so much more to the story and it all comes blubbering out by the time you get them to the principal's office... doesn't it?

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justathought 6 years, 10 months ago

Muskno, since you seem to know it's FACT, maybe you should enlighten the rest of us. Board members are public officials so you can name names, places and times of illegal meetings. Employees are just that, employees; they have the right to get together and discuss whatever they want, unlike the trustees. You say they "were sitting there discussing or making up accusations", does this mean you were there? That you actually have personal knowledge of this FACT or is this just another case of "I've been told", "I heard", "I think" or "I believe" just like 99% of the wording on the statements included with the petition? WHEN will the citizens of OC quit believing everything they hear and look into FACTS on their own. A conspiracy, yes, but not as you suggest, it's conspiring to get rid of a police dept. that is doing it's job. This whole thing reeks of deja vous, haven't you learned anything yet?

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justathought 6 years, 10 months ago

Muskno, You are the one that said " someone could get to the bottom of the FACT" so I have no interest in calling bar owners to get more hearsay. You state Doug "got wind of the secret meetings", that is exactly my point, all this crap gets started and spreads and no one knows anyone that actually witnessed anything. You said "I am very good friends with both parties I am speaking about & have no reason not to believe them", SO they somehow "get wind" of something, tell you and you automatically believe it because you know them. THAT is exactly how rumors get started, just once maybe you should ask for proof. I doubt you were present for all of the incidents you described above so you are really just helping rumors along, Thanks for making my point. I watched lies, unsubstantiated rumors and alcohol embellished "facts" ruin OC officers before, like I said, deja vous.

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bluntman 6 years, 10 months ago

you sure run your mouth over something you say you know nothing about, madkowpunkin. if you, J., Doug or anyone else has real evidence of "secret" meetings, bring it forward, otherwise shut it. you allege criminal activity on the part of the other boardmembers as "FACT", yet you have no "FACT(s)" to share with the group. public meetings are posted ahead of time, there is no "conspiracy" except in the mind of a few paranoid shriekers trying to villify the police dept. and the active boardmembers. if you or J. or Doug or anyone else feels that there has been a violation of the "sunshine law", bring your evidence to higher authorities such as the State Attorney General. they take these sort of allegations very seriously, maybe you should as well. you are starting to sound alot like the former mayor who quit and/or one of her minions (or someone who has recently received a citation from our fine police dept., - or was it one of your close relatives?)

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corduroy 6 years, 10 months ago

just a stupid question, but who got the survey? Is it just the town? I live in Stagecoach which is technically Oak Creek and I never got a thing.. don't want my input I suppose

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bluntman 6 years, 10 months ago

if you receive utility service from the town of OC you received a survey form with your utility bill. don't feel too left out cord, the OCPD does not serve the suburbs (yet) as far as i know. that ended with the taxpayer-funded taxi service provided by the former chief who quit as a courtesy to a couple of bar owners. no need to feel snubbed if you didn't receive a survey... OC probably doesn't need to have the whole county telling us how to run our police dept. we already have enough drunk monkeys here attempting to do the same.

way to go, madkow. not your "duty" you say, but you allege criminal activity of elected officials with no substantiation. there is no "conspiracy" in an open public meeting that has been posted ahead of time as required by law. if you or J. or a business owner doesn't read the notice and attend a meeting, whose fault is that?

and what is all this rabble about a petition? what does it say? where do i see it or sign it? do i have to go to the bar to participate in this exercise in "democracy"? i guess i need to get out more often to be able to participate in OC's version of "the Jerry Springer show".

soooo booooring, though. really.

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

The surveys came out in the O C light bills Feb.1

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

There are two types of petitions. One is used for elections (such as nominations for town board or a recall), and can only be signed by registered voters of the area involved. The other is an opinion poll (such as what is being passed around now). It can be signed by anyone with an opinion from anywhere, any age. The last time I checked everyone is entitled to their opinion. If you don't have a problem with the police, in your opinion, you would not need to sign. If you have been stopped, regaurdless of where you are from, in your opinion, and were not treated fairly, sign up.

The OCPD does service out in the suburbs. They go on numerous calls outside of OC. They make stops outside of OC, they assist in wrecks along 131 and go to assist other officers in Stagecoach, P-Burg and Yampa. Technically they are the OCPD but they do agency assist regularly, so I guess that would make it other areas business. I'm sure if you stop by Town Hall, they have some extra surveys and would be glad to have your imput. It is anonymous, so I guess it doesn't really matter where you are from!

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bluntman 6 years, 10 months ago

every recipient of a minor traffic citation is entitled to feel like a "victim". no argument here, go ahead and sign up. just one thing: where is this opinion poll "being passed around"?

don't forget to pay your fair share for sevices received, either, 'cat. no different than schools, fire district, library etc. etc.

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below_me 6 years, 10 months ago

musk sits around listening to the scanner, then gets on here and asks if anyone knows anything about _ (fill in the blank). She spreads rumors and gossip. It is who she is and what she does. Just ignore it.

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

Mus, the town lawyer made it perfectly clear at a board meeting that there are only two times the board can go into executive (closed) session. One when obtaining real estate (they would not want the other parties to know what their strategies would be in negotiations). The other would be regarding an employee and their job performance. In that case, the employee would have the option to hold an open or closed session. The board acknowledged that they had been schooled in that the year before. It is hard to believe that they would fall right back into repeating past mistakes after such a short time.

Did that transmit over the scanner about town businesses since that is what blow_me believes is where you get your info?

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Bluntman: the "petition/opinion" documentation sponsored by Colorado Bar owner Becky Elliott is available at the OC Town Hall. Since it comes under the Colorado Open Records Act, and has been submitted to the Town Trustees, you can request a copy of same -- think it costs about $3.00 (copying charge).

From what I understand, the "survey" (completely different document from the "petition/opinion documents) was indeed sent out to Oak Creek residents in their utility bills -- not sure if it's limited to OC residents or not -- you'll have to check.

Hope this helps.

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

I,m curious about a couple of things. I,ve been hearing about the high fines for breaking one of O C 's traffic laws, $156. for running a stop sign, $160. for 10 mi. over limit, and I,ve heard about some even higher. Fact... A motorist who wrecked on 131 got a ticket for improper mtn. driving, too fast for conditions. It was a $56. ticket. That was from the State Patrol. That doesn,t even compare. Who sets the amount of fines ?The town board or the policeman who issues the ticket ? Or is it a set amount from the state??

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

below -me, what a sign in. do you think you,re above everybody or just muskno. or did you mean "blow me !! "You sound like you think us scanner listeners are gossiping just because we get on here and ask questions, but maybe you are just bashing muskno because she/he got close to "your "skeltons .If you check things she says she generally is pretty much on with her facts .

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

nmyopinion: If I'm not mistaken, fines are set by statute -- State of Colorado Model Traffic Code -- which Oak Creek has adopted. You can look it up online.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Gotta love the scanners (or hate them). I remember growing up in South Routt and having my parents know what I did before I even got home thanks to the blasted scanner. :) Maybe that is not such a bad thing after all. Too bad that there are so many that like to repeat every nugget they hear on them and look for substantiation of any hearsay as fact.... ahh small town life. Absolutely no privacy. Get a life people!

Unfortunately it takes every law enforcement officer needs a little time to get to know their community and who the busy bodies are; too bad Russ has made mistakes in this process. I have been pulled over (for speeding) by Russ... and rightly so. Does that make me a victim of his overzealous law enforcement? Maybe; but does it change the fact that I was breaking the law. NO!

My Dad always said that if I am going to break the law in any manner (no matter how trivial) I should expect to pay the consequences whatever they may be. Really the responsibility lies on all of us. I guess I don't see that it matters what the fine for any infraction is and who sets them. It is a matter of OBEYING THE LAW.

Let's see how long it takes for lawlessness to return to OC... would you rather we return to the late 80's when the town cop cars were parked at each end of town empty to try to get people to slow down when there was no law enforcement (oh wait, I am sure a very vocal minority would actually like that).

As far as OCPD responding to Yampa, Phippsburg, Stagecoach, etc. It is NOT uncommon for interagency agreements like this to exist in a civilized society.

I cannot imagine how anyone in OC can have skeletons... too many busy bodies to ensure they don't stay there long.

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

For folks who do not live in Oak Creek but wish to support Chief Russ ,sign up to be a volunteer in Police service(V.I.P.S.). Anyone can join, not just Oak Creek residents. It requires the same background clearance as if you were applying to be an officer and alot of papewwork. The mission basically requires 2-4 volunteer hours per week filing papers, shredding,vehicle maintence and helping Cheif Russ put together grants and programs to help O.C. residents at no charge. Finally the rest of Routt County can step in and help return O.C. back into a normal everyday town thats not over run by drugs and thugs that cause a hostile living environmnent for the majority of quiet, non political citizens. Many in outling areas have wanted to take up for O.C. so now is the time. If you have ever appreciated Police, Fire, Ambulance and any others step up in their honor. They of course will be watching and wondering . The previous decades sure make all of us appear to not be the foundation or even care that the Police Dept. was being undermined. Lets get it right from here on out. The meeting is at O.C Town Hall at 7P.M. located 1 block back behind the O.C. post office. The building meeting room is not very big. If it's packed and no room call Chief Russ at 736-8355 the next day and let him know you take a stand for the goodwill of all people and wish to sign up to be a V.I.P.S. If time does not allow you to volunteer stay active in supporting Chief Russ by writing letters to the newspapers,phone calls and internet actions. Also try to remember any possible information whether in the past or present that could assist Crime Stoppers in irradicating drug activity. Example: Years ago someone you knew struggled with drugs as a dealer or manufacturer but now is clean maybe.Crime Stoppers can take that old info. and check that persons phone records and contacts to find leads that apply today . Such as some of those folks could still be dabbling in drugs. Get serious! Any scrap of info. matters. It is not possible to completely see drug transations some times only bits, they are use to tiny pieces of information at Crime Stoppers. The goal is Zero Tolerance for Drugs in Oak Creek. This we can do in Honor of the Oak Creek Kids and other Loved Ones who died because of drugs.To the families we deeply regret not taking a stand. Please forgive us. Today is a fresh start we promise to do better. Call Crime Stoppers 870-6226 now.

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

Shortbus, the only reason I asked about the fines is that they seem to be unfair and no I haven't been stopped and fined. I agree that if you are breaking the law it's your own fault if you get stopped. Nobody wants the druggies, drunk drivers, dealers(drug) etc. off the streets more than I do.I just wanted to know why O C fines seem to be so high compared to the rest of Routt Co.

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OneFly 6 years, 10 months ago

The many thoughtful and intelligent comments are so refreshing to read and represent the reality rather than the other. Those who feel they or their businesses have been harmed are their own worse enemy by allowing untruths and innuendo to flourish and fester that in the end falsehoods become truth. The facts of any given accusation can be determined fairly easily if it involved police. This has been done little if at all. The fact this effort originates from the same place not that long ago where a whole different set of accusations was the topic of the day and circulated from there. There was no substance then and hardly any now.

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madmoores 6 years, 10 months ago

I do not live in Oak Creek and so therefore do not have an opinion one way or the other regarding the issues you have. I only wanted to comment on the Boys and Girls Club of America. I live in Craig and we have been blessed with this outstanding organization which is staffed by a dynamic group of people dedicated to guiding our children in the right direction. The latchkey kid is a thing of the past, kids out roaming the streets has decreased and children are happy to have a play place in which to share with their friends without having to concentrate on schoolwork. Not only that but the kids have pride in the club as each one of them are members and they pay dues, all of which instills a sense of ownership in something good. In my opinion, every single community, no matter what size, should have a boys and girls club of some kind. Kids these days need direction, direction away from the vices some of us possess(violence, drinking, drugs)and the B & G club is a perfect place to do just that. If there is anything that a community can do for it's residents it is to provide some sort of outlet for our youth, something it seems that Oak Creek is crying out for. The Boys and Girls Club of America is a great place to start and I support them 110%. If all goes well and you seem to get a voice of approval, call up the club in Craig and find out how to get started, I'm sure they would be happy to guide you in the right direction(some adults need guidance too). Good luck to all of you, Oak Creek sure is a beautiful place.

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upstream 6 years, 10 months ago

muskno- It has long been a marvel to me how you always seem to "know" so many more "FACTS" than the rest of us. Gossip from parts far and wide- so much of it directly related to law enforcement...hmmm...an inside source, perhaps? Just strikes me as a little suspect. Maybe you really are simply a gossip of epic proportion- who am I to say otherwise. And, as we all know, gossip generally comes around to bite the gossip in the butt. My longwinded point here is to suggest you avoid making accusations you cannot publicly substantiate (ie. this secret meeting hooey)- you have slandered our town trustees, and as you seem to know all there is to know regarding law enforcement, I'm sure you know this is a crime. If Doug or J want to make these sort of allegations I would suggest they do so through proper channels (not bar gossip)- unless, of course, they relish the thought of a lawsuit thanks to Ms. MusKNOWITALL.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Shortbus -- maybe the empty police cars were parked at both ends of Oak Creek in the '80's -- but shortly after former mayor Rodeman took office, they were parked -- empty again -- at both ends of the town -- and eventually vandalized.

On a more positive note -- YES to the B&G Club -- it's been a long time in coming and it seems that Oak Creek now has the proper individual(s) in place to make this a reality. And, I'll bet ya it'll be done right!

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Yes to B & G club; the kids here have needed something like that for years. I hope it gets off the ground. There have been so many good ideas. Lets make this one stick.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

muskno... all I can say is WOW; I just looked at your 27 pages of posts. It is only a matter of time until you are sued for slander. It is not too difficult to see who you really are... and an electronic record of your rantings. Ma'am step away from the scanner.

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

Cargo is gone and they are still parking police cars at both ends of the town.

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Dave Ege 6 years, 10 months ago

I must say that the response time by the local law enforcement to the tragic explosion and fire this morning was about 4 minutes. I would say this is exemplary reaction time. Too bad it looks like there was loss of life, and a very good man who did alot for Oak Creek

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

nmyopinion -- at least they have officers in them now!

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Scott Wedel 6 years, 10 months ago

I signed the petition and added a letter explaining why I signed.

I do not doubt that Chief Russ is a decent guy and I have been pleased by his reasons when I have dealt with the police dept.

I have also recently had three people complain about being stopped and questioned at the laundromat None of them thought there was a valid reason to receive that sort of police response. These three complained to me because the police suggested they were doing what I wanted. Thus, these people complained to me so that I would stop asking the police to be stopping my customers. Considering I never asked the police to do anything other that pursue clear cut cases of bad behaivor caught on video, I am not happy that people are experiencing such heavy handed tactics.

Also, in the case which the police stopped a pedestrian, I cannot figure out what was the probably cause for stopping the person. I twice have brought this to Chief Russ's attention and each time he said is that all they need is suspicion to stop someone. I have verified that the legal standard is "probable cause", not "suspicion".

I have had ZERO complains by customers about the police in the previous 8 years.

I think Chief Russ is a good guy. I think the big problem is that people are being stopped without believing there was probable cause. If the police dept could just clearly explain the probable cause to the person of why they are stopping that person then I think the problems between citizens and the police dept would largely be solved.

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candylane 6 years, 10 months ago

FYI The meeting has been cancelled because of the town's recent loss.

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bluntman 6 years, 10 months ago

the meeting has been postponed, not cancelled bacause of the town's recent loss.

it seems the right thing to do in light of what has happened in the Community today. i am pleased that our municipal officals have shown sensitivity and respect by deciding to hold the event at a later date.

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

Candylane, Jimbo needs to take his red pen and go around and correct where the Police Chief posted his cancelled signs. At the post office and the town hall is says cancelled, not postponed. I'm sure you meant "until further notice" which is also what the signs say.

Hulk, would that be the same officer that had a "Wyatt Erap" complex? Scarring little children when he drew his gun on their father and threw him in the middle of the road, right in front of them! Hey that did happen! And would you be that same officer?

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SoRouttNative 6 years, 10 months ago

Ok, so I have sat quietly and watched the ranting of the very vocal minority on these posts, town hall meetings, and other public forums and have had enough! Although I no longer live in South Routt, as property owner I have a vested interest in what happens in Oak Creek. It seems like nothing ever changes in the town... just the names and faces. Same BS as when I was a kid in SoRoCo schools over 20 years ago.

If you would FOR ONCE let law enforcement do what they are hired to do and what I pay taxes for them to do then perhaps your town could actually be something. Instead, you continue to allow your drug cartels and drunks push any decent leadership out of your town. I am sorry, but I am at my wits end with the way the town is run... time to sell my property and buy something where it ISN'T run by organized thugs... Even as a kid I knew which business establishments would sell to me under age; nothing has changed there either.

So what if a cop pulls you over when walking and questions you? Is it really that big of a deal? If your town did not have such a horrible reputation as being the armpit of Routt County you would not have this problem. You are an embarrassment to South Routt.

You wonder why people are not beating down the doors to buy $400k homes on the hill overlooking this dysfunctional mess? (that is NOT just the economy).

I had purchased several lots in Stagecoach but have since divested myself of them when I learned that the OC Fire Protection District would be running them and that Stagecoach is looked at more like an extension of Oak Creek than Yampa or Steamboat. Don't destroy Stagecoach like you have your own town.

You have created yourselves as a pariah and will always have a horrible economy with honest hard working people barely getting by. To all business owners: IT IS THE ECONOMY STUPID! My take is if law enforcement is driving business away then you really ought to look at your clientele.

I have always believed, and know, that there are some good people in Oak Creek. TAKE BACK THE TOWN ONCE AND FOR ALL! No offense, but if the Colorado Bar shut down tomorrow it is not a great of a loss. Nor would it be a great loss to see many of the current businesses disappear.

It seems every chance of momentum that the town has it gets destroyed by the same politics that existed when I was a kid. I am so glad that I never called Oak Creek home, but had the unfortunate requirment of attending junior and senior high school there!

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below_me 6 years, 10 months ago

It would appear as tho musk and her 27 pages of gossip and rumors has vanished from our midst. Oh Happy Day!

nmypinon, you musk no how transparent you are.

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justathought 6 years, 10 months ago

Whoa, what does one have to do on here to disappear into thin air?

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

If you must know,I am not muskno. I too was wondering where she went. below I think your eyes must be brown.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Whoa... I think someone hit a nerve with SoRouttNative; need you be that harsh?

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

not to belabor a previous post but... let me break it down:

from aufait (Category of "more to the story") Buying candy bar at laundry mat at 10 pm
Buying a soda at 5 am Is your hair dyed Throwing snowballs; I am sure there is more here than throwing snowballs. We used to throw snowballs from the Jr. High School down to 131. Riding around town at midnight Unaccompanied Minor? Ticketed? I hope so. Driving a car (married daughters) that is not owned by yourself Driving Through Oak Creek

(Offenses that absolutely deserved a ticket) Not coming to complete stop at 2 am Ticketed? I hope so Jaywalking Ticketed? I hope so for the moron's own safety Hitch hiking inside of Oak Creek city limits Ticketed? I hope so; there is a statute against it after all (CRS 42-4-805). The same statute addresses walking while drunk in case you are curious.

No police officer would "go after" someone without suspicion at a minimum. Probable cause as a previous poster so aptly stated is only one criteria that police officers use to make contact with citizens; although it usually used for search of a vehicle or person with permission. Suspicion is another.... gee I can't imagine what an officer would find suspicious about any of the activities that posters have brought up...

Coming from a family of law enforcement I can definitely see why they would make contact.

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

What happened to the Oak Creek Forum? Town Board members and employees were showing off certificates of accomplishments several months ago about Oak Creek's web page. I saved the link because you could go and it had municple codes and other info about Oak Creek. Now when you click on it, something out of the cornfield comes up. Didn't the town of Oak Creek pay for this web page?

http://oakcreekforum.blogspot.com/

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SoRouttNative 6 years, 10 months ago

Aristocat,

I certainly hope that Oak Creek did not pay to have a blogspot.com site set up... they are free to anyone who wants to set one up.

It would be a great idea for Oak Creek to have one though.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Timberline/nurmidst -- while disagreeing with you about seven's posts, it is a given that you have the right to express your opinion. Seems that seven is only trying to EDUCATE AND OPEN UP LINES OF COMMUNICATION, based on FACTS, not RUMORS AND INNUENDOS. Thank you, seven.

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

Much thanks to the brave person who called in on the drunk in O.C. Sat. but is listed in Mon. record. Great start of the O.C. clean up drugs and drunks watch. Pulse progress by checking the weekly record on Sunday. Last 2 Sundays no O.C. names. Room for error because some folks come into O.C. leave drunk and the record lists their home town.

nurmidst seven-"Adolph would love you" ?Please clarify? Why do you support drugs in the A.C.E.T. article(Fri.?Sat.?) Why Adolph? Adolph comparison terrible. Are you just looking for a response?

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Timberline 6 years, 10 months ago

Seven: Give it a break! It sounds like you are trying to stir up more drama than there needs to be.

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CoJustice 6 years, 10 months ago

For citizens not familiar with the State Statute, "Creation Of Community Policing Programs" should do a little research. It is the responsibility of local law enforcement to protect the public peace, health and safety from disturbances of public intoxication, drunk pedestrians or any potential dangers that pose a risk to the public. It is a shame that your first consideration is not the safety of your community and family.

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below_me 6 years, 10 months ago

Let's hope there is a written test for that concealed weapons permit.

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

colorado123

Back to the search for a O.C. mayor thats not associated with drinking--and no offence to you colorado 123, you have been honest about owning one of Yampas liquor stores in the past and seem to still be unbiased.

Rita? Marsha? Need much info. Try to get others on the search as April is nearing.

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seven 6 years, 10 months ago

colorado123 Sorry, you currently own one of the liquor stores in Yampa. I thought you had sold it.

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eastboy 6 years, 10 months ago

I think this space takes up far more space and time [on both sides of the fence] than it is worth!

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nurmidst 6 years, 10 months ago

seven- I guess i was just thinking out loud after reading your post. should citizens with acne, two dogs and a lot of friends be expecting "seven" swat team members knocking there door in if they live within binocular view of you? turn in people you knew years ago anonymously to go through there electronic communications and there contacts round up anyone with different ideals,religious beliefs, does that ring any bells?

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oldskoolstmbt 6 years, 10 months ago

hahaha...nurmidst, thank you for finally saying something about seven's rediculous blog!!! SEVEN...you should take your blinders off more often than only when you are in OC...drunks, thugs & drugs are everywhere baby...and enough of "The Teachings of Crime"....

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oldskoolstmbt 6 years, 10 months ago

southrouttmukker---i like your sense of humor:) good one!

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michyah 6 years, 10 months ago

oldskoolstmbt nurmidst

Sevens comments are usually exactly how the majority feel.This person seems to always stand up for no drugs, no drunks driving, a firm backing to law enforcement agencies and familiy morals. This leadership attitude brings out the nair-do-wells every time. Amazingly leaves the 'noodle backbones' clapping and cheering that are not yet ready to stick their own necks out.

Guaranteed front row dispute.

GOOD VS EVIL

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below_me 6 years, 10 months ago

c123 i doubt you are a transplant from anywhere. transparent yes transplant nfw.

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michyah 6 years, 10 months ago

colorado 123

How can the law be changed in O.C. to allow other locals to run for mayor of O.C? Such as Stagecoach,Yampa? O.C. would gain nothing if the liquor store guy runs for mayor. Obviously he wants to only protect his income with no regard to the towns need to clean up. Surely there must be some common citizen with morals in Routt county. Notice Colorado123 is staying on top of the search. Keep going with finding O.C. candidates. The end of all this will be worth it if Oak Creek finally is inhabitable for working families.

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oldskoolstmbt 6 years, 10 months ago

michyah....i believe most decent citizens (myself included) hold all of those issues in high regard ...i didn't realize this is a crime lesson forum...my bad..and thank you seven for being our BLOGGING MAJORITY LEADER!!!

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

Colo123 Dude you are so far out there I cannot keep up with all of your "statements". You first stated that you lived in Denver, then something about your pad in the boat, then P-burg and now yampa. You SAY you are 98 and dying. I think if anyone is questionable it is you. You do not know if you are coming or going. You must be pretty close to tmac (maybe you are him) because it seems that the 2 of you have nothing better to do than to complain about OUR mayor and his business. And if you do: live in Yampa, are 98 years old & are dying than why are you so worried about what is going on in the OC? If you don't live or work in the OC why are you saying about what "we" have or "we" do. Are you pregnant or do you have a mouse in your pocket? Why would any one ask someone from Yampa to run for the OC's mayor position, unless they were being sarcastic! If you live in OC, get your paperwork done and run for mayor. If your not, quit stirring the pot!

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nmypinon 6 years, 10 months ago

SO WHAT 123.?? YOU'RE A yAMPA PERSON THAT LIVES IN THE OC? You can't spell' half the time you ,don't even make sense most of the time, and all you do is knock OC. There is no reason for you to be upset about OC unless you have a vested intrest in it. So why don't you come clean and just quit beating around the bush. You live in,own a business in,or work in OC. You have nothing good to say about the town but every thing you say is WE HAVE.....WE ARE...WE THINK... Well ME THINK you are blowing smoke. The only good idea that I have heard from you is the Boys & Girls club. And why would anyone suggest you for a mayor anywhere let alone Oak Creek. What are your credentials. You said you fell off the path and a man in blue helped you back on. and according to you if you have ever been in trouble for anything .you should't be able to run for a mayor or town board Why don't you run for mayor of your "OWN" town and leave OURS alone. I listen to a scanner and it sounds like YOUR town also could profit from closer law inforcement instead of having to wait for RCSO even though I think RCSO has a very efficient and fast responding force. WHY , if you live in Yampa, aren't you concerened with the crime rate there???

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Timberline 6 years, 10 months ago

aristocat & nmyopinion- Nice posts! Very good points in both of your comments. I agree with both of you, but be ready, now you've opened a new can of worms. Colo123 will have fun with this one, and it's going to be interesting to read the response.

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

OK Whats Becky done to to loose her liquor license? And lets just have facts not rumors

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tmac62 6 years, 10 months ago

aristocat thats not me colo123 does not speak for me

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Scott Wedel 6 years, 10 months ago

Look at the names that signed Becky's petition. First, if you know Becky then you know it is ludicrous to suggest she coerced people to sign. Second, if you know people in OC then you know people that heard about the petition and went to Becky in order to sign it. If the issue was the law finally being enforced then why did the local Real Estate agents and others that would benefit from a nice crime free town sign the petition?

I do not think Chief Russ is a fundamentally bad guy or officer, but if you get that many people upset at you then you should consider the possibility that you are doing something wrong even if it is just failing to explain yourself.

And sergeant Eric's letter defending himself states that he stopped a woman for failing to stop at a stop sign, she passed the breathe analzer (maybe because it didn't work), she was passing the roadside sobriety test until she started shivering because it was so cold, decided to give her a warning and then that it was legal to pat her down because the Supreme Court has ruled that officer safety is a sufficient reason for a pat down search.

Why a pat down search was needed prior to giving her a warning was not explained. It is hard to understand why after passing a BAC and roadside sobriety test that then the officer decides his safety is threatened in a way that it wouldn't be safe to give the warning and end the stop, but instead a pat down search is now needed. It is hard to avoid thinking of other reasons such as intimidation as the real reason of a pat down search prior to letting the woman go with a warning.

And yet supposedly the Town Board members on the Police Comission reviewed this case and found nothing wrong. Not even that such actions are not wise because they raise the appearance of impropriety. No, the problems are blamed on rumors and the bar crowd.

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michyah 6 years, 10 months ago

Scott

The realtors on the east end bought a tiny building for the office that has no real parking. The curb starts to round and the realtors car plus any customers, back end would be illegally parked and in the way of traffic ,many times when we have passed by, trucks barely fit. If these are the ones,law enforcement could be seen as a problem, instead of blaming themselves for not planning and purchasing a better location.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Scott, you are perpetuating rumor. Unless you were the woman that was patted down "unnecessarily" you have third party information. Third party information is what began this crap in the first place.

If all of the names on the petition are individuals who have had DIRECT contact with the "overzealous" law enforcement then there may be some substantiation (unless they were too drunk, stoned or stupid to intelligently interpret reality). If the 60 plus names on the petition are individuals of "my friend told me that..." then it has no validity in my opinion and should not be looked on as any interpretation of how Chief Russ is doing.

On pat downs... there are reasons and procedures; what law enforcement officers live by and help ensure their survival in case the people they are in contact with are of a nefarious nature.

Did you ever wonder why most law enforcement officers touch the side of your vehicle when they walk up to it? I can assure you it is not because they lack balance. They want their prints on your vehicle in case you are stupid enough to try and drive away.

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Dukebets 6 years, 10 months ago

To Shortbus and Colorado123,

Scott seems to have well informed information and to be right on point. If you know Scott, his information did not come from the bar crowd or rumors, so don't blast him for stating facts.

Plus, a high majority of the signatures are not from the bar crowd. Signing such petition does not make an individual a drunk or a druggie. It means they have opinions and want to be heard.

And, it is a free country the last time I checked.

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justathought 6 years, 10 months ago

Unless scott was dressed as a woman, shivering in the cold while being patted down or an actual eyewitness, he is stating hearsay, not fact. DEJA VOUS. It's worked in the past, why not try it again.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

So you sign a petition based on hearsay?

It is ABSOLUTELY critical that you are heard and I do agree that there is a forum for voicing your concerns to your elected representatives; but railroading a guy trying to do a job he is hired for (albiet maybe more aggressively than some people would like as I have stated earlier) is not the way to do it. All based on "somebody told me that this happened to so and so".

At what point does this become slander? http://www.nolo.com/definition.cfm/term/85BAB88B-0660-4AB6-A2F5C32E716A6D52

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justathought 6 years, 10 months ago

shortbus, check the history. Every time OC gets a working PD that does their job and won't look the other way, they get railroaded. I don't know if town hall keeps this kind of record or not but if you researched complaints, law suits, and petitions of years past you will find a pattern and the "abused" don't care whose life they ruin in the process.

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Dukebets, I don't think I claimed that all of those that signed the petition were of the bar crowd.

My question was were all of those who signed the petition informed enough with first hand information to be able to intelligently make the decision that the Chief's actions are hurting business using substantiated and statistically relevant data points. If the group were armed with statistically relevant information showing causality then perhaps they would have a leg to stand on.... as it is now it is hearsay and slander.

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aristocat 6 years, 10 months ago

Shortbus sounds like you have a personal knowledge of slander!

Would it be slander to say that Russ completely lost it at the Town Board meeting? Which I have found stange that no one has commmented on since the meeting was packed. Also that Eric is on leave pending investigation on some of his cases? Which sounds like "all the complainst are not without merit" as Russ would have us believe! When you only have two police, one looses control at a board meeting and the other one is on leave, doesn't sound like everyone in Oak Creek is wrong with their feelings of unease concerning current law enforcement! I have not heard anyone say they want them gone, just loose some of their current hard handed practices.

PS Even though I support J as a mayor, I am not of the bar crowd or druggie!

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shortbus 6 years, 10 months ago

Aristocat, nope that is not slander... it is not rumor or innuendos. Could get you a defmation suit though.

I have no personal knowledge of slander. I am very careful not to make slanderous remarks about individuals or repeat rumor as fact. It does more harm than good.

I guess the meat of this really is whether or not the petition has validity. Can the signors of the petition, using empirical evidence, prove that the law enforcement tactics currently employed have caused a direct impact to their balance sheet.

If the police have committed the atrocities then file a suit (civil or criminal) against them. To me it sounds like (Aristocat) that the administrative process is actually working if one of the officers is on administrative leave pending an investigation.

My very last post on this subject... "The wheels on the bus go round and round; round and round, round and round."

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Why is what Scott has to say so almighty important anyway? He may own businesses in Oak Creek, but don't believe he lives here. Not all business owners in Oak Creek were contacted regarding this petition; most (but not all) of the businesses "signed" on the "petition" have liquor licenses. Also, a review of a lot of the legible names on the aforementioned petition aren't Oak Creek residents either. The illegible signatures -- anyone's guess.

Have to agree with justathought -- a working PD is not wanted by SOME of the businesses and individuals who do not accept responsibility for their actions. Oak Creek is NOT all "drunks and druggies," although Oak Creek does have its problems in these areas -- just like any where else. This petition, spearheaded by a minority "group" is, once again, causing a small hysteria and putting Oak Creek in a bad light again. The present Board has really worked hard AS A TEAM to balance the Town in the last year and a half.

aristocat: FYI, Eric is NOT ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE -- better check your source/facts on this information. And, as far as Chief Russ "loosing" it at the last Town Board meeting -- he was merely responding to an attack on his integrity -- and rightfully so! Wasn't the "attacker" less than diplomatic? Maybe that's why no one has brought it up -- except you.

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Dukebets 6 years, 10 months ago

MsBronte - Why is what you have to say so "almighty important"?

You sound like two new board members who preach like they are higher than the almighty.

And, the petition effort was spearheaded by the wife / business partner of the head of this present Board that you are so proud of.

What a joke

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 10 months ago

Dukebets: OOPS! Was a nerve hit? Have a lot of respect for both Jay and Becky ... don't understand why you took this so personally. Still think this Board is amazing in what it has accomplished -- including hiring a PROFESSIONAL Chief.

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justathought 6 years, 9 months ago

clevedave, maybe fisher & wisecup are doing a little investigating before they allow the drinking crowd to burn these officers at the stake in a public forum (again). It would be very wise of the non conflicted board members to investigate fact from fiction when it comes to the bar patrons and owners that just want to get rid of any LAW ENFORCEMENT. I don't think anyone has a legitimate beef with these cops per se, it would be the same with any officer that respects his position, does his job, and refuses to look the other way. I wonder how many people have really learned something and will come out and vote; or will it be "here we go again".

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 9 months ago

Clevedale: New forum meeting with OCPD/citizens has been rescheduled for March 4, from what we've been told.

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Dukebets 6 years, 9 months ago

colorado123 - I suggest your comments be removed or you have the cones to state what you just said above in a public forum.

Did you realize that the OC has one of the most respected Fire Departments for a small community in the entire state? Chuck Wisecup is the Chief. Other members are Saw, Rocky, Phil and Becky. Guess What...........There last name is all Wisecup.

Richard has towed 100's of abandoned vehicles for the Town of Oak Creek. You think he has ever been paid? Nope! In fact, he doesn't even ask to be paid. Do you know anyone in S. Routt that plows Senior Citizens driveways for only $8? I do.........His name is the Renegade.

That's a pretty good family in my book.

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justathought 6 years, 9 months ago

123, And what did the Wisecup's do to you to make you so hateful toward an entire family? I doubt you have half the credibility trustee Wisecup has, nor any of his integrity.

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nmypinon 6 years, 9 months ago

I would just like to clear up a few things.Becky Wisecup is not on the department but her husband Levi is.And Kelly lipsie who is the wife of Dixie is also on the OCVFD.And as far as Fisher goes he seems to have a temper problem. I agree with Duke Renegade does more free things (or cheaper than most) for people in this town than one person would even consider. 123:it seems to me that you just have a personal problem with the Wisecups!You obviously have no idea who is running for a seat on the new board. 9 out of 10 times if you ask any Wisecup for help you are going to get what you need with out them blinking an eye. Weather they drink or not.Or weather or not they have junk in their yard.Get a grip.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 9 months ago

123 -- sorry you're having such a bad hair day -- have an idea -- why don't you gear up, start another towing company in OC, become an EMT/firefighter/OC code enforcement officer/snow plow driver (at $6 an hour vs. $8)/fire department chief/Town trustee/etc. On this one, have nothing but high regard for the WHOLE Wisecup family (that's the correct spelling, by the way). These guys/ladies are nothing short of dedicated. Ever needed their help? They're there. They have INTEGRITY.

P.S. Perhaps a spelling course would help YOU spell names correctly and you won't come across as a rude, uneducated person with a vendetta.

Hope your day gets better.

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aristocat 6 years, 9 months ago

Dukebets, you are right, about the Fire department. The only change I would say is that Levi, not Becky is on the fire department. Do not forget that the only son-in-law in the family, Kelly, is also on the fire department. They not only go to the fire calls, but often are on hand to drive the ambulance.

On the note of volunteering, Becky, Rhonda and Sandy are on the Labor Day Committee giving endless hours, enrgy and money to help keep up almost a 100 year old celebration. Again all of them have the Wisecup name.

Renegade and crew often have done snow removal for free as well as tow's. Chief Russ had to remind Renegade to send the town a bill for pulling both cruisers out of the snow.

Colo 123 -- You are talking trash about a family that is not only part of one of the oldest in South Routt, but connected to nearly every family here. If you are not lucky enough to be related to them, then maybe you have been lucky enough for them to have touched your life in some way. Maybe that is your problem, you are one of the unfortunate ones that have not been worthy of their giving.

Colo 123 There is an old saying "Sometimes it is better to keep your mouth shut and look foolish that to open and remove all doubt" In your case, it would be posting!

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shortbus 6 years, 9 months ago

I know I said that I was done... but I lied.

123 no problem with you voicing your opinion... God knows we all have them. Just wonder about the personal attacks.... I too could make comments about bad blood with prominent families in So. Routt such as the Wisecups; but what good does it do... besides we have to remember that some people do eventually grow up and some even become respectable.

The wheels on the bus go round and round, round and round, round and round.

The wheels on the bus go round and round all through the town.

Same story different day.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 9 months ago

123 -- you ARE entitled to your opinion -- you have actually made some good points!! It's just the personal attacks that aren't really necessary. Don't give up when other views are expressed -- BTW, don't believe "so many" OC people are anti-police; just think those who are are very vocal about it. Almost to the point of being intimidating. Yes, there are drug/drinking problems in this town ... just like in a lot of other places; seems like every time a professional PD is on board in OC, a minority of the citizens (and non citizens) start rumors of abuse, etc. and wear the officers down to the point they give up and leave, or are fired, or administered whatever brand of "execution", public ridicule, etc., is on the menu at that time.

Opinion: this latest debacle about the OCPD comes just before another election of the Town Board. Perhaps this is just another way to steer citizens away from the real issues facing this Board and the new Board -- i.e., current financial status of the Town, possible B&G Club for the children, outstanding grants the Town has no $$ to back, etc. The list is almost endless.

And, there are usually two sides to the story ... truth somewhere in the middle?

Please give it another chance, 123.

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justathought 6 years, 9 months ago

Okay, now what happened to 123, when we get tired of playing can we all just take our comments and go home?

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below_me 6 years, 9 months ago

good riddance to her but she ll be back with a new name. same rants new name. nuckin futz.

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shortbus 6 years, 9 months ago

Bronte.... The wheels on the bus go round and round, round and round, round and round. :)

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 9 months ago

shortbus: all through the Town ..... (two part harmony! LOL)

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Timberline 6 years, 9 months ago

I also agree about our Fire Rescue Department. (Ambulance crew included) They always have unbelievable response time to any call that goes out. These men and women put their heart and souls in what they do. About the Wisecups', I don't know one of them that would not help someone. Whether they know them or not! They are all very nice people and I think they are all an asset to Oak Creek. They work hard to support thier families plus volunteer countless hours to Oak Creek in one way or the other.

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nmypinon 6 years, 9 months ago

WELL WELL colo123, I see you are gone.Good riddence. who do you think you are to state that only one person in seven are GOOD . I have known John Crawford, AND Chuck Wisecup for a lot of years, Probably most of thier lives and they are upstanding lifetime OC citizens. I'VE known Jay since he came to OC and I know of no time he has been thrown in jail or arrested for a crime.You have no Idea how much he has contributed to the town ,the schools, and the familys of OC. You need a place to have a receplion for a benefit, a funeral, a wedding he bends over backwards and never charges anything. He contributes to Labor Day Celebration, Taste of South Routt. and applied for the thankless Job of OC MAYOR. That should show that he cares for this town. I don't know Angie and not much about Spike but they aren't bad people as far as I have heard. And I don,t know Tom but do you have anything that says he isn't good. I agree with Dukebets and justathought and unless I'm mistaken Renegade is who provides for the Dumping service so you can get your trash hauled for nothing on cleanup day!! Oh sorry, you don't live in OC. If the Wisecups Decided to leave the OCyou would be short a Fire chief,and five firemen, one EMT, two public works employees, one towing service, three recycling co. one town board member, one planning commision member, one medical center member, three laybor day commitee members, five high school athletes, two honor choir, seven band members plus plus two snow removal co.s. Yes maybe the OC would be better of without them, so the likes of you could come in and doze the town.Isn,t that what what you said you would do with all the property you are amassing. Oh yea I forgot Sandy . She was only on the OC ambulance for 21 years, as a volunteer EMT and directed the labor day parade for years. And John Crawfords family also has done a lot of good for the town. His mother Pearl was with VNA for years taking care of the sick and elderly. You have no right to run our citizens down. Get a life!!!!

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egoeater 6 years, 9 months ago

nmypinon

A visit with a lost friend of who you may have questions likes to own liqour stores,well one. Looks like a cabin. D. if you recall stirs up trouble in OC and loafs at Black dog futher south each day[according to his informative posts], then runs back to the s. routt town further south. He loves to talk and no doubt needs someone to listen.

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egoeater 6 years, 9 months ago

Some of co123 commments at first seemed good such as supporting the police dept. but looking further his comments were sugar coated to lay a path his "little" liqour store could benefit from. Trouble in Oak Creek would send people to Yampa and other areas. The later in evening sometimes it seemed he got blurred vision. Does he drink or was he just exhausted?

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nmypinon 6 years, 9 months ago

egoeater, if you're right,that would explain why he keeps the ongoing comments "people will just bypass OC via hwy 14 and buy their liquor in yampa", Thats pretty cheap advertising But it wouldn't explain his "Wisecup bashing. I thought D. was a friend of theirs. Have you heard to the contrary.

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egoeater 6 years, 9 months ago

nmyopinion

Unknown on that. Slyness apparent in posts. Question would he be angry if he thought someone who drank alot did not purchase from him?

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egoeater 6 years, 9 months ago

nmyopinion

Guess proof could be ? just checked the search and it says 'page requested can not be displayed'. Others come up o.k. . Apparently he may of called himself to have posts removed that are date and column enhanced. Sure odd. Oh well. Still easy to look at posts one by one. He commented on alot of blogs, not just Oak Creek.

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nmypinon 6 years, 9 months ago

how do you check the search? How do you look at the posts one by one since all have been removed

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egoeater 6 years, 9 months ago

nmyopinion

You are right. He now has them all gone, Think may still have copies I made but not his last day.

Remember when he first opened liquor store and used to call liquor 'liquid'? He wrote those words in all his blogs. I have never heard anyone but him call liquor 'liquid' have you?

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nmypinon 6 years, 9 months ago

egoeater.. you're right but everything else was misspelled also. I figured to try and keep anyone from figuring out who he was.

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otterbdone 6 years, 9 months ago

THE OC HOME OF PEOPLE THAT ARE GETTING SERIOUS ABOUT THUG CLEAN UP.

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otterbdone 6 years, 9 months ago

While getting groceries last night noticed OCPD in grocery parking lot arresting another drunk driver. God bless you Eric for serving and protecting our lives by putting you own life on the line. Who knows who that drunk may have run over. OCPD does a fantastic job and I stand totally behind them!!!!!!

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justathought 6 years, 9 months ago

Thanks otter, let's see what new tale of brutality/harassment emerges next week, born of this arrest.

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uporpeopleu 6 years, 9 months ago

u little freaks that think u know what is and what isn't should be at the meeting tues at 7.maybe u'll be surprised at how wrong u are. maybe u'll never admit there is a problem no matter what u hear. did u hear the oc judge requested another magistrate, attorney and court clerk for the town because of the ridiculous case load? bet that's not in the budget. no. erik and russ have not been rounding up all the big bad druggies and drunks. u'll just have to be there to hear for urself. all 1st hand stories and not from what even you villains would call "bad guys".

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otterbdone 6 years, 9 months ago

u po' u

Why are you worried the town budget cannot afford Judges? Does the Judge currently not help OC for free or near it? With the mess of drugs and drunk drivers do you not understand other Judges would assist OC for free until law and order is restored? At worst scenario the cost is minimal.

Besides with all the good and ABSOLUTELY FAIR arrests Chief Russ and Sgt.Eric are making the revenue may rise high enough to buy OC it's very own courthouse.

Look on the horizon neighbor a new refreshed OC is coming.

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confused 6 years, 9 months ago

I had to put in a post, but no I have not read the previous posts. Sorry if this is redundant. I am all for law enforcement in Oak Creek, if it is the right person(s) for the job. Linda, no...These guys..no. But rather a happy median in between. Someone who will not get the already struggling town in a lawsuit for civil rights violations and stupidity. Luckily we dodged the ticking lawsuit waiting to happen with the last cheif, but now we are in for round two. I know that at least one police commisioner for Oak Creek reads this forum every day. So I hope you listen close because you are a good friend of mine. The Town Board members need to straighten out the police department either by properly training them through other local law enforcement agencies or starting over by firing and re-hiring. I think most of us want #2. Check into where the Sergeant worked previously, why he was fired. Why he was not hired by SSPD or the RCSO. Why was he "let go" from the State Park at Stagecoach..FISHY!! The Cheif, administrator previously in charge of records. No real law enforcement experience, check into it--make a call. I went into make my complaint and the chief was more concerned about telling me how he had a black belt in something and no one in this town could take him down. WOW!! Who cares, not me. I was there to make a complaint against his Sergeant that is in charge of who?? Got me, so why promote him to a Sergeant. The OCPD will not have a three person law enforcement agency again, at least not anytime in the next several years. Cant afford another person. Neither one of these guys has had proper law enforcement training prior to taking to the streets solo.

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confused 6 years, 9 months ago

Food for thought to all of you out there. Been pulled over for dirty license plate, snow covered plate, defective vehicle, speeding (no not you guys that deserve the ticket 10+ over posted limit), not stopping at the stop sign (no I mean really not stopping). Watch how they drive, act, react. Almost every time they are out you can catch them doing the exact same thing you just got the ticket for earlier. Call your local police commisioners and let em know. Got a vioce recorder, use it, put it in your car. Should you have to....NO. But, why not. We all want them out, but without a little evidence to use on our behalf then we are stuck with them. I know several cops in the valley and I know that if they were to be recorded during a stop that all would be well. Cant fix whats not broke. But our OCPD is broke and WE need to fix it. My personal suggestion for this fix is to fire them. You have more than enough to fire them, besides-this is an at-will fire state anyway. Dont re-hire, this town is broke!! Let the more than capable RCSO take over. Let them put their outpost here. I think you will find that their ways of community policing will be leaps and bounds over the current or previous PD. Sounds bad but let the county hire the extra deputies needed, they have the money to do so. I know that some deputies won't like working Oak Creek but if not then try to look at it as a "project." One that will reflect well on the county. Oh, just read the previous post. It takes real cops to dig up dirty criminals, we dont have them. They can only contact those who they feel wont bite back or the ones the chief feels he can smooze with his black belt bs talk. Remember when the cops from the RCSO and CSP would stop in town and shoot the bs with our local cops. Huh, not no more, wonder why?! Ashamed and don't wan't to be around when they screw things up!! Wanna talk, see u at the meeting!!

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confused 6 years, 9 months ago

The last post may be misleading so I want to clarify. If you deserve the ticket just take it, admit it and go on. Same with a jailable offense or any other PD related issue or life event. Fess up to your mess up. On the other hand, if you didn't do it, were treated unfairly or in my case (well, I can't say or it might give me away! Sorry, Identity first) deal with it. Use your voice and your elected officials to bring resolve. I am not against law enforcement at all... Just our special little short bus officers that need a change of career.

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otterbdone 6 years, 9 months ago

confessed confused

Better check info. again Chief Russ has more degrees than a thermometer. Communications?

Good attempt in quickly adding the 3rd post ....Clean it up so I do not reveal my only goal is to abolish any and all law enforcement in OC.

Wake up. The old bar mentality of OC is ending. It did not work in the past and citizens were left asking "what happened to our money?"

Albeit it did seem funny watch folks stagger from the bar over to the town hall polictical arena. Something should have been awakened then. But none of us could hear the vacuuming of money diappearance at the time. Was this decades ago or when?

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shortbus 6 years, 9 months ago

Annnnnnnnd theeeee wheels on the bus go round and round, round and round, round and round.

The wheels on the bus go round and round all through the town.

I do hope those of you who have preached for change and a desire to clean up your town (it is not mine anymore; I sold everything I had there because of this *) put actions where your words are.

It won't be easy. You have generations of attitude, slothfulness and drunkenness to overcome. If it means a change in law enforcement, so be it. If it means a change in leadership then so be it, but get yourselves out of this quagmire or you will always be looked at as you are today. A dirty, stinky armpit of Routt County.

Over the years there have been so many coming in with the broom message only to get sidetracked by the dust bunnies in the corner and missing the bigger problems... don't let it happen anymore.

Voice your concerns at public meetings, talk to your neighbors, be at the polls, provide solid (with as few skeletons as possible), viable candidates for your leadership and take your town out its current state. This could very well be one of the most critical times for leadership in your town.

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Slapper 6 years, 9 months ago

shortbus writes-This could very well be one of the most critical times for leadership in your town.

shortbus is correct!

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shortbus 6 years, 9 months ago

u po u... I don't disagree with you about what OC really is... but the reputation is different than your perception.... just go outside of your little world of family and friends and you will see it.

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snowcloud 6 years, 9 months ago

Whoa! We need some television writers or producers to read this forum...It sounds like a new t.v. series...Oak Creek!

I don't know anything about Oak Creek, since I'm new to Colorado, but, I already know the "characters"....or should I refer to them as the "Creekers?"

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confused 6 years, 9 months ago

otterbdone - he can have all the degress he wants. That doesn't mean he has experience in the job. A degree doesn't make you good at something either. And no I don't want to demolish the law enforcement in OC - I just want someone down here enforcing the law that knows how to do it. Someone that will respect the citizens and focus on the real problems - not jay walking or harrassing someone buying a candy bar at 5 in the morning and not someone that treatens to take a very harmless man to jail for asking a question at a board meeting. There is a way to police and a way not to. They need to learn the right way.

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confused 6 years, 9 months ago

I stear away from the rumors (lies) - People like you are what make me confused...

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confused 6 years, 9 months ago

otterbdone- lets chat at the meeting, shall we! You apparently don't live here. If you do then I will assume you are a barfly. Oh wait, did I assume something? If you live in Oak Creek you must be a bar fly. Sorry to crash your special party but I have not been to the bar here since last Labor Day and I was only there for about 3 hours to visit with old friends and not slam beers. What am I doing explaining myself?? Crazy huh... Sorry that you don't believe that good old honest law abiding citizens who don't put up with your crap live here. Again, find me, lets talk!! I do my homework before I get on here typing my day away. I am not full of rumors. Can't handle the truth then go to another page and type to someone who can spill out unconfirmed rumors..

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uporpeopleu 6 years, 9 months ago

short butt...u can not possibly mean what you wrote??!! "If it means a change in leadership then so be it, but get yourselves out of this quagmire or you will always be looked at as you are today. A dirty, stinky armpit of Routt County." u are more of an ignorant idiot than u even know. the oc has some of the finest food, freinds and family i have ever experienced. everyone seems to help everyone else. i felt welcome since the day i got here. everyone waves and smiles. i think u may be the dirty, stinky armpit of routt county! also, the generations that have been here for so long....they are what makes it the warm, friendly town that it is.

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Ms_E_Bronte 6 years, 9 months ago

Whoa!! The mysterious 123's cousins are posting??!!??

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otterbdone 6 years, 9 months ago

Shortbus

Sorry you had to sell the home and leave OC because of the minority of thuggery.

Maybe one day soon you can return home. Many positives arriving each day in the OC.

Tomorrow's OC meeting is at 7 P.M. Alot of mislead people intend to rid themselves of Chief Russ with lies and half truths. But here's what the word of God say's about His anointed men and women "of the cloth". Ps. 105:15--"Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm". Chief Russ is a Messianic Rabbi, and is anointed [ has the spirit of God on his life ] to preach the Gospel.

There's not a chance he would ever intentionally treat any one unequally. For slightest wrong word he would apologize. Communications are always open and he really seems to enjoy new ideas and citizen input.

OC does not realize the value of Chief Russ. One good chance will be given likely before he gets called away. These types briefly enter our lives to spread peace and love for one another. We turn if only for a moment and as if Angelic, they disappear. This is'nt the first time I've seen this. Happens alot in non-Bible belt areas where people are not allowed to here the Gospel.

As for those whose intentions are corrupt towards OC progress.

ll PETER 2:10-But Chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.

In a nutshell---do'nt be afraid ever to communicate concerns. Make sure it is the truth and not fabricated or stretched in any fashion.

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otterbdone 6 years, 9 months ago

Already filed a corrupt complaint? Cancel or change it. Do not follow the crowd that follows untruths. Make choices for yourself. Separate from those that are not seeking peace but spend their days howling about OCPD at the coffee shop and nights bellowing beer boasts about hatred for OCPD.

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Timberline 6 years, 9 months ago

Southrouttmucker: Wouldn't it be nice to be able to pick who we wanted. I know a few Routt County Sheriff Deputies I'd love to see as our O.C.P.D, but that will never happen. I liked Officer Tritz also, but I don't ever see that happening again. Maybe in time the current Officers and the citizens of Oak Creek can find a happy medium. I doubt everyone will be satisfied, but that almost never happens anyway. There will always be complaints on both sides of the fence.

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justathought 6 years, 9 months ago

timberline, it would be great if the citizens and and OCPD could find a happy medium but, with comments like "they are here to serve and protect, we don't like being policed", I doubt that is going to happen. These are cops that are not going to shirk their duty just because the bar crowd think they should get special treatment. Too many general statements like "none of the kids trust them" or "all of the kids are afraid of them" and no reason given as to why. No, these people won't settle for anything less than getting rid of a PD that works and goes back to a chief that does nothing except bar checks to chat with owners and patrons while ignoring drunks.

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nurmidst 6 years, 9 months ago

Whats wrong with serve and protect i thought that was a standard police "motto" a lot of towns have that printed on there patrol cars! Maybe that is to inclusive for some who only want there agenda pushed on everyone!

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nurmidst 6 years, 9 months ago

otter- is that you seven? i thought i recognized that rant!

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Timberline 6 years, 9 months ago

justa: I think maybe a medium will be met. I think that last night might of been a stepping stone. I did agree with some of the comments, but I also disagreed with some. Sliney's comment was the worst..... Maybe she does have a privileged position where she sees the worse side of the problems in O.C, but to pass judgement and say that an Officer would intentionally leave a child in a bad situation, is nothing else but an out right lie! Routt County Child Services are always notified about cases involving neglected or abused children. The staff from the RCCS work very close with O.C.P.D Officers, past and present, as they do with any Law Enforcement Agency in Routt County, that has to see situations of that magnitude. They do follow-ups just like the Officers do. It's not a matter of whether the cops did thier jobs or not... It's a matter of the parents not giving a ***t about thier kids. I bet the same kids they dealt with are the same kids that the current Officers are doing welfare checks on now. Sure the officers can remove the children for the time being, but RCCS has the final say so. If they check things out, and investigate the situation and release the children back to thier parents, how could it possibly be the officers' faults? Officers are called in emergency situations, and remove and hold the children in protective custody until the appropriate agencies are notified. Then the children are released to them. The Officers are nothing more than the middle man. That comment was ridiculous! That's my opinion and sorry if I have offended anyone.

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upstream 6 years, 9 months ago

I guess we are all entitled to our own point of view Timberline. I personally took her remarks to suggest that we have far more serious concerns in Oak Creek than the endless ire of those who feel their civil rights are violated whenever they are stopped for speeding, sliding through stop signs, etc. It is high time the citizens of Oak Creek start to pay more attention to the needs of our children and elders and start paying NO attention to those who insist upon distracting the town trustees from the real issues at hand. Can't comment on the rest of your rant there regarding RCCS and the OCPD- but I will comment on some of the remarks I found far more absurd... -Bernie implying the trustees "destroyed" a tape of the last board meeting...haven't we played this one out? Enough of the conspiracy nonsense already! These are good people doing the best job they know how. -Ronnie Crawford trying desperately to whip up the masses with his incoherent litany of "police offenses" and getting NO response whatsoever...also pretty welll played out, eh? Maybe Cal Martindale publicly dispelling the rumor regarding his truck being "slammed into" by Chief Russ took a bit of wind out of the rumor mill? Thank you Cal for your integerity and courage. We can all learn a lesson here. All in all, this was the most impressive dialogue I have ever witnessed in Oak Creek. Thank you to the trustees, commissioners, police officers and citizens who made it happen- may this be a sign of good things to come.

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innovated 6 years, 9 months ago

I couldn't agree with you more Timberline. Jen Sliney's comment at the meeting obviously proves she has tunnel vision and uneducated information on procedure regarding any neglect/abuse in Oak Creek. Fact: when ever there is suspicion of any neglect or abuse in Oak Creek or any surrounding town, reported in by call or officer suspicion, it is called in to Routt County Human Services in which they arrange for a surprise visit to the house to investigate, with officer, and ultimately make a decision from fact finding. All agencies follow that protocol and follow up on all welfare checks. Anything suspicious is immediately turned in to Routt County Human Services. Sliney's absurd comments about the former chief is pure character assault if not defamation and is based on an uneducated opinion. I ponder if she ever turned in any of her suspicions to the proper authorities or was it just more productive to just add to the rumor mill? I think she came across very unprofessional and clueless.

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oldskoolstmbt 6 years, 9 months ago

hahaha...seven/otter, PLEASE leave UR god out of this one..PLEEEEEEEASE!!!!!!

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