Wall not concerned about staff

New Routt county sheriff, undersheriff to renew certification

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Gary Wall

— Routt County Sheriff Gary Wall and Undersheriff David Bustos have at least a year to renew their inactive Peace Officer Standards and Training certifications. The men said they will not have a problem meeting the deadline.

Both attended an optional 2007 County Sheriffs of Colorado Conference and Vendor Show in Westminster last week where they attended sessions led by state and federal law enforcement agencies and participated in sheriff and undersheriff training courses. Wall attended a mandatory Sheriff's Institute from Dec. 4 to 15 in Denver.

Wall and Bustos received their POST certification in the 1970s while working as Vail's police chief and assistant police chief respectively.

Their certifications became inactive three years after the men left law enforcement.

Wall said Bustos most likely will attend a two-week, 80-hour "refresher academy" in February to renew his certification. The refresher course also can be taken online through Arapahoe Community College or by skipping the academy and taking the written exam and skills test needed to acquire POST renewal.

Wall and Bustos have one year to obtain their POST certification and can apply for a one-year extension if renewal is not obtained within a year.

"It's not like I am in a hurry to do that. I'll do it when I think that's appropriate," Wall said. "Not having (POST certification renewal) won't hinder my duties in any way."

Wall is required to receive 20 hours of ongoing training throughout the year, which can be satisfied a variety of ways.

County Sheriff's of Colorado offers 126 different training programs to sheriff's offices across the state, which Wall said he likely will take advantage of.

"Certification will not be an issue for me," he said. "There are plenty of options for us all to get plenty of training."

After being sworn in as Routt County's 25th sheriff Tuesday, Wall said he and Bustos are eager to face the challenges in assuming their new roles, including dealing with staffing shortages.

Wall announced he would not renew the commissions of former Undersheriff Dan Taylor, Sgt. Dan Kelliher and Rachelle Redmond, leaving the department down a sergeant and investigator.

"We're short a few in patrol and few in detentions and we're working on that," he said. "I'm certainly not concerned about it."

The cases Taylor, Redmond and Kelliher were working on before being released from the Sheriff's Office will "not go by the wayside," Wall said.

"Those cases will be adequately investigated by the very capable people working at the (Sheriff's Office)," he said. "I will make sure those cases are not dismissed by inappropriate investigation even if I have to do it myself - which I am capable of doing."

Wall, a former private investigator, said his business, Gary Wall & Associates, LLC, is over, but that he will testify in cases he may have done work for in the future.

"I'm an elected official so I can't work for a private entity, but that doesn't mean I won't testify to what I know," he said.

Wall said testifying in a trial is not illegal.

"It has to do with justice and due process," he said. "I have no problem testifying what I know."

Comments

mikartay 7 years, 3 months ago

Sheriff Wall's non-committal comments regarding his and his undersheriffs POST Certifications slaps in the face all of those whom have completed this important training. This is mandatory training for all Colorado Sheriffs and Under Sheriffs as well as all of his patrol and investigative staff. I disagree, he needs to be in a hurry to get this training.

The citizens of Routt County deserve a well trained Sheriff...not a talking head.

I'm sure your paper will get fantastic press from this administration in the years to come.

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Camo181 7 years, 3 months ago

Davinci -- good word -- recall; give him enough rope ... you know the rest; it's obvious his egotistical attitude reeks of the fact that he feels he is above all of us...his own office at the courthouse so he can hold court? Give me a break. I would think he would have his certificatioin as top priority on his list. I hope his immediate bosses (three County commissioners) see through his egotistical facad and put him in his place. Wasn't he voted in to be a PUBLIC SERVANT? I doubt he'll ever see the light. But again, give him enough rope...

I agree, POST should investigate why Redmond and Kelliher were summarily dismissed (by one of Wall's "messengers"), and make it public.

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fish 7 years, 3 months ago

Well why don't you get that started. I have no problem with Wall but if you go in this week and get the paperwork started I will not only sign it but I will carry a petition around for you, because I think that you are all talk. Step up or shut up.

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upriver 7 years, 3 months ago

If making quotes that are viewed as arrogant after only two days in office is a basis for recalling a publicly elected official, then every politician in the U.S., including our President, is probably in trouble. It seems to me that we need to judge Wall by his actions (and inactions) after he has had a chance to do something. To his credit he went ahead of time for 10 days of training in early December and last week. These are actions that we can pay attention to. Lets see how he does on being a sheriff, protecting and serving Routt County.

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BERKLEY 7 years, 3 months ago

Davinci: What is it: are you an estranged ex-girlfriend of Walls, maybe Wiggins Wife, or are you just a sore loser? If I do not recall Wall won the election by a good majority! He took office two days ago. You haven't even given him a chance. Grow Up!

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onethought 7 years, 3 months ago

Yes indeed, give the man a chance. Davinci, you are most certainly a sore loser for whatever reason. There is at least one other investigator who is post certified at the sheriff's office right now and I am sure that person can handle the case load. Grow Up is right!! The majority of the county elected Wall, it's now time for him and his staff to get the job done. They have worked short staffed for a long time as you recall the paper telling the story of how SSPD continually recruits it's people from the sheriff's office after they get out of fto.

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concerned 7 years, 3 months ago

Actually, if you check the records Steamboat carried Wall into office. The outlying areas that really depend on the Sherrif's Office voted for Wiggins! Those people are the ones that are going to suffer under Wall's reign. It is unfortunate that the current staff has to work for an egotistical, ignorant, self serving moron. Give him a chance you say? It's only been two days, you say? I say his true colors are shining through! If he manages to make it through the next four years without turning the Sheriffs Office into a joke, it will not be by his doing. It will be the good people currently working there that will carry him through.( That is if he can keep the good people around!)

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Matthew Stoddard 7 years, 3 months ago

So...did the extra "coronation" for Coltrane & Enos cost us more in taxpayer money just to make it "special?"

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JQPUBLIC 7 years, 3 months ago

Now why should Wall be worried about staff? If he needs extra help he can always bring in the dogcatcher from OC: whoops, I mean chief of police. He's promised to aid and abet her when she gets overworked and needs a day off, why shouldn't she reciprocate. So RoCo Deputies, feel safe out there, you now have 2 outdated untrained bosses and an overpaid dogcatcher... (whoops I mean chief) watching your back. Giving the new sheriff a chance stopped the minute he outright lied and went ahead and "cleaned house" by firing 3 very well qualified officers after he said he was not going to. He also said he wasn't going to walk in there and make all these sweeping changes without getting employee input first, well these 3 employees didn't get their input. Any one of the three officers that were fired is immensely more qualified for their positions than those that were elected to lead.

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onethought 7 years, 3 months ago

The past sheriff's office was run by the undershiff, Dan Taylor, who was not liked by all, and said very loudly that he would not work for Wall if he was elected, and Redmond said the same thing while running with Wiggins on several occassions. Every one seems to forget what they have said in a public place and could be repeated until it comes back to bite them. As for Keliher I don't know but the others who are gone said they would'nt work for Wall anyway so....... what goes around comes around.

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another_local 7 years, 3 months ago

Why is it that some folks think that the people in Steamboat are somehow not part of Routt county or that the sheriff's office does not serve the city? Where is the jail? In terms of staff, infrastructure and budget the majority is located in and directly serves the city as well as the rest of the county.

On the deputies that did not receive commissions; if these individuals said publicly that they would not serve under Wall then he is both right and smart to clear house now. All the rest of us in the working world are suject to loosing our jobs at any time without cause, no explanation, no public hearings and no call for investigation. If there was no cause you get an unemployement check and go job hunting, what's the big deal?

With the kind of solid majority Wall won by a recall will not fly.

What is the big deal about a certification that can be had with a two week refresher course? That can not possibly be the most important part of a deputies qualifications... or if it is we should all be concerned.

When you don't get your way it is time to cowboy up and make the best of it. Quit'cherbelliaikin.

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another_local 7 years, 3 months ago

No, I don't think so. It is about recognizing that you do not always get your way and moving on.

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bcpow 7 years, 3 months ago

davinci...I mean #s...or whatever you will change your name to next...I could tell it was you long before I saw the name. Thinking you might want to call yourself wormtongue on the next go around. How about we wait until Feb to start the recall?

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

Everyone knows that it's no secret that a certain ex-mayor of Oak Creek, and friend of Wall, didn't like Deputy Keliher. That stinks of personal agenda on Wall's part. It also defeats everything Wall said during his campaign. It's very unfortunate that the new Sheriff has started off his term by fulfilling a personal agenda, firing a very qualified deputy (Keliher is a lot more qualified than Wall and has a lot more training), and lying to the voters/citizens of Routt County. The County Commissioners need to ask Wall some tough questions.

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another_local 7 years, 3 months ago

Get a grip numbers. Wall was not Sheriff the 27th... that one belongs to the outgoing crew.

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flipside 7 years, 3 months ago

Just so everyone's clear here - DAVINCI is just NUMBERS reincarnated. No doubt.

And if you want to know who NUMBERS was, just hang out at the SSPD wives auxilliary bake sale ...

Good God woman, get a life. Do something POSITIVE with your time.

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Scott Wedel 7 years, 3 months ago

JQPUBLIC, You are just simply mean. By "the dogcatcher from OC: whoops, I mean chief of police" - you mean Linda Koile whom was first hired as code enforcement, has taken all the classes and training that you say is so important for Gary Wall to take, became a fully certified peace officer and eventually became chief.

Someone that has worked that hard to improve herself should be respected, not mocked.

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Camo181 7 years, 3 months ago

ScottWedel: Respect is something someone earns based on their actions -- not a given. So is integrity. Peace officers should be held to a higher degree of accountability. I'm not mocking Koile, just observing.

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another_local 7 years, 3 months ago

Are JQ and Camo the same person?

Davinci, why don't you help out by calling the various offices that are displaying the flag wrong. If done in the spirit of helping I am sure they would happy for the help... but that is not your purpose is it?

You know as well as anyone that it is probably the janitor or some other hourly person that raises the flag not the person in charge. This is not some show of disrespect it is a mistake. Why don't you just help out for a change?

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JQPUBLIC 7 years, 3 months ago

No, JQ and camo are not the same person but it sounds like we both were disgusted by the political faction in the Creek that is now spilling over into the County. Wedel, going through the classes that Koile did made her QUALIFIED to BECOME a police officer, who was her field training officer and for how long? The only reason she made officer and then chief was because she was such a good friend and yes woman to the ex-mayor (that did not want working cops in town). Respect... sorry... when she earns it she will get it. I have total respect for qualified law enforcement, I believe that the majority of them are overworked and underpaid. I have seen first hand some of the actions (and inaction) of OC's chief, it's my opinion she was not even a good dog catcher. Now don't get your bowels in an uproar, as I said, my opinion... and I'm entitled to it.

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goldilocks 7 years, 3 months ago

flipside- your comment about the SSPD auxillary wives club is very insulting- not just to davinci, but to other wives as well. Why does is matter who davinci was or is? Keep your personal comments to yourself.

Davinci- bring on the RECALL- let me know where to sign up- Iwill be there with you, as will many many many others!

I know for a fact that the POST certification in Colorado is not an easy task. It takes between 4 and 6 months of course work, weapons training, driving instruction full-time, and usually away from family. The State Patrol course is evern longer. So getting 2-week refresher course doesn't seem to cover the issues in my opinion. Maybe if wall and bustos had lost their ceritification within the palst 5 years, a refresher course would be appropriate. But since 1979 there have been SO many changes to law enforcement that 2 weeks won't do. Just in the past 10 years, we have had 2 MAJOR event in our lives that have changed policies and procedures dramatically. The unfortuante events of 9-11 and the terrible shootings at Columbine have changed every aspect of crisis response and crisis management for law enforcement. If we really want to feel safe and secure, we shoudl demand that both wall and bustos get certified properly, and we should not let either of them appeal the decision, or extend the deadline.

As far as the voting in Routt County, it is very unfair that the the "Republic of Steamboat" elects our county officials. We all know that Steamboat is in Routt Coutny, we're not idiots, but Steamboat is in the VERY capable hands of the SSPD for law enforcement. The SO does the rest of the county. I think that maybe it's time for a change in how County officials are elected. I think that every part of the county, Steamboat, Hayden, Oak Creek, P-burg, etc. should get one vote according to how the citizens of each part vote. That way every part of the couty gets equal voice, as in the US Senate, and the smaller communities in the County get heard rather than over-powered by the population of Steamboat.

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Camo181 7 years, 3 months ago

I believe, but am not absolutely sure, that a recall cannot be instituted for at least 6 months after someone is elected to a public office. On the bright side, maybe Wall will do a complete turnabout...become an honest, respectable PUBLIC SERVANT with integrity. We wouldn't want to take away his livelihood (with no notice) without evaluating his performance would we? Remember, give 'em enough rope...

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Camo181 7 years, 3 months ago

Another local -- are you related to Wall? Hourly employees and janitors are people too. Why the derogatory attitude towards a good majority of the working people in Routt County? All of you high and mighties are coming out of the woodwork since this election.

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Scott Wedel 7 years, 3 months ago

Regarding respect, it is reasonable to say a person is not doing a good job at their current job. It is not reasonable or fair to continue to refer to a person by the lowest ranking job they once held especially when that person has worked hard to advance to her current job.

And if you have problems with how Police Chief Linda Koile is doing her job then express those concerns at a Town Board meeting. I note that under Linda's tenure that there has not been the dramas and controversies that had been affecting the OC police dept. So if she is doing a poor job then she is apparently doing a good job of covering it up.

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JQPUBLIC 7 years, 3 months ago

Sorry Wedel, it's your opinion she worked hard, my opinion it was handed to her. Your opinion that "if she is doing a poor job then she is apparently doing a good job of covering it up" and my opinion she just does nothing at all. The "dramas and controversies" were caused by a select group that believed it was their right to drink and drive in OC because it is a small town. Their attitudes...If you get stopped for DUI or drugs, you can kick, scratch, scream, fight, spit and then yell "police brutality", then they could get rid of working cops and replace them with cops that look the other way. The thing is, the other barflies (and even some non-drinkers) in town believed the bull... they were being hand fed even though they never personally had a bad interaction with any OC officer. I am not a teetotaler but I do believe that if you break the law you deserve what you get. The political faction in OC is changing, the citizens have had their eyes opened. You want fancy subdivisions filled with families that will shop in OC, you'll have to take care of the drunks and drugs first, and the best way to do that is to get a real Police Department!!

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another_local 7 years, 3 months ago

There was nothing derogatory in my comments about who raises the flag. I was just pointing out that it is not the kind of thing that is the direct responsibility of the new sherriff, does not autmatically indicate disrespect, and is most likely a simple mistake that he was not aware of made by a busy person with other responsibilities.

In most places I have worked that had flags, the people who put it up and took it down were the people responsible for the building operations not the boss. The exception to that was when I worked at Clay HQ in Berlin... but that's another story. Don't be too quick to read disrespect into what people say.

Has anyone who is concerned about this simply picked up the phone and called the sherriff's office about the flag? Or is the pupose of this discussion just to look for ways to attack Wall?

I am not related to or a friend of Sherriff Wall. I did meet him during the election. I also met Officer Wiggins.

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another_local 7 years, 3 months ago

"I know for a fact that the POST certification in Colorado is not an easy task. It takes between 4 and 6 months of course work, weapons training, driving instruction full-time, and usually away from family. The State Patrol course is evern longer. So getting 2-week refresher course doesn't seem to cover the issues in my opinion."

There is something I can agree with. I retract my earlier comments on the post cert as being un-important. I was responding to what I understood was a two week course. (You can learn interesting things in two weeks, but not enough to be the foundation of any profession all by itself) Is the post cert the police academy? Is that different?

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Ilike2dv8 7 years, 3 months ago

It's more than okay to do a double take when a newly elected official feels that it's important to make such a strong statement when entering office. Who's to say if the move was necessary but the timing of the decision was clearly reckless. Stepping into a new management position (let alone a law enforcement situation) and firing key people seldom proves to be effective nor does it show good leadership. Although I did not know both of the deputies that were terminated I did know Ms. Redmond. Based on what Mr. Wall campaigned on I was more than a little disturbed to read of her termination. Having worked closely with law enforcement (mostly federal) for over twenty years, Ms. Redmond was one of the finest people I ever had the pleasure of working with... I'm certain the department will miss her greatly.

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Scrapiron 7 years, 3 months ago

Listen up 'Frederic's of Warsaw', oops I mean JQ Public and her friend Camotoes...do you ever tire of the continuation of your berating of Oak Creek police? Or Cargo, who is no longer there? Or Gary Wall, who hasn't even been in office a week, and you just bash him to the point that you appear silly. Do you not have anything you can contribute to the town for positive change? Your hate bowl is amusing but clearly shows ignorance, tunnel vision and narrow mindedness. Any one with intelligence knows that Chief Koile earned her position, has done lots of work with code enforcement to current policing, got thrown to the wolves alone, and yet, she made it work. But of course, you both are so filled with hate and malice. Could it be that there are some deep dirty little secrets that you have in your closets and think no one knows? Hmmmm. A certain x police chief comes to mind: in fact two of them.....or perhaps inappropriate behavior with a camera? Gee, Oak Creek is having the laugh on you. Don't throw stones if you live in a glass house.

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RickBevan 7 years, 3 months ago

DaVinci or #'s who ever you are, that's a total LIE. I know Ms. Koile personally; and I KNOW for a fact that her weapon is always at her side regardless of what the "call" is. No Officer in his/her right mind would be without it especially on a domestic. Get your facts correct you appear pretty ignorant of what actually goes on here in Oak Creek.

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

We all know that Gary Wall had some dealings with the local law enforcement community before he ran for sheriff. Maybe his decisions about the terminations are a reflection of what he saw from the other side of the thin blue line.

Twelve years of experience in the RCSO might not count for very much if you had inept leadership the whole time. You don't learn how to do very much from people who specialized in doing nothing.

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aristocat 7 years, 3 months ago

Has every police officer you know always acted without fault on every call? How about the SSPD officer that forgot to put his car in park and it hit another car. Or the CHP officer that was rushing to a wreck on 131 and hit another car? Did these incidents not put people in harms way? Try a little empathy for our hard working officers. I'm sure that if you check yourself, there have been times when you wish you could have a redo and were happy that your actions did not effect anyone but yourself! The three officers, all though they did a great job, made it clear they could not work for Wall. How would Wall be an effective leader if he did not surrond himself with people that supported him and his ideals? If you want to make a change, do something about it! If you are not part of the solution, then you are part of the problem.

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

Bottom line is that Gary Wall did what he did in terms of those terminations. The very unprofessional part of the whole situation is that he fulfilled a personal agenda and personal promise. Lie to yourself all you want about Gary Wall "seeing something from the other side of the thin blue line" and that was his reason for terminating someone like Keliher or Redmond. He very publicly stated that he was going to get employee input about change. That is obviously a lie. He terminated 2 employees that have years more experience and training in law enforcement than he will ever have. Sounds to me like he was intimidated by these 2 professional law enforcement officers; why else would he talk out of both sides of his face.

As a tax payer and someone who respects the men/women in law enforcement (as well as those in the military), I'm ashamed to hear that Gary Wall treats his certification as something that he will "get to when he feels it is appropiate." That should be one of his first and foremost priorities, because it would show his employees that he does care about being a certified police officer and he respects them as certified police officers (it's not a walk in the park to become certified). To this citizen of Routt County, it sure does appear that Gary Wall thinks getting his certification is nothing more than a waste of time. People will argue that statement, but go back through the articles (in the Pilot) regarding Gary Wall talking about getting certified. Throughout his campaign and even now, he has continually treated the certification like taking out the garbage (no big deal). Hopefully Gary Wall can make amends and be a decent Sheriff, but so far I'm disappointed in his treatment of the office he was elected to.

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

Hmmmm,

So tell me, Grasshopper, how being certified made things better under Warner and Taylor all those years? Did either one of them EVER make an arrest in all that time?

Maybe the smart thing for Wall to do is get some qualified, senior officers into the RCSO before he takes time out to go take his two-week refresher.

Aristocat,

The errors you describe are examples of poor training, which leads to poor performance under stress. Omitting a critical step (leaving the car out of park) or driving beyond his ability under stress is nothing more than "buck fever" demonstrated by an ill-prepared officer. I've seen CHP patrol cars blow through downtown doing 50 or better on the way up to an accident on Rabbit Ears Pass. How do I know? Because I saw him coming and counted the seconds, and then paced off the block. 50 is a generous understatement. OH, lights and sirens would have been a nice touch too . . .

The two closest calls I've had driving in the past few years were a near-miss by a police car (no lights, no sirens) while I was changing lanes to make a left turn. I was doing about 30 in a 35 zone, in a strange town, at night, no other traffic around, trying to get back on the freeway. The cop was blazing along and had to swerve into the oncoming lanes to avoid hitting me. He kept on going and, guess what . . . STOPPED A SPEEDER about two blocks down the road. I sat there and watched it happen while waiting for my left turn arrow.

The other was a cop who came speeding down the blocked left lanes on a four-lane bridge to the scene of an accident, applied his brakes, and spun around three times on the ice before coming to a stop just short of the accident vehicles.

As a military pilot in the search and rescue business, I was taught that the safety of the flight crew and the public comes before the duty to any single victim of a boating accident. You don't want to kill 4 people in the aircraft trying to save one person in the water. People who think it should be otherwise have been watching too much TV.

It's not so much fun, or so exciting, to end up in a big old crash of some kind just because a cop thinks he has authority to dash around like a mad man on PCP. Taking an extra minute to navigate Lincoln Avenue in the business district is highly unlikely to make a life-or-death difference to someone who was just in a wreck on Rabbit Ears.

If you look up the statistics for law-enforcement officer deaths in any particular year, you'll find that traffic accidents take the highest toll. 73 of 151 officers killed in 2006 died in traffic accidents. Failure to use seat belts was a major contributor. http://www.officer.com/article/article.jsp?id=34169&siteSection=2

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

id04sp- Simply stated, Gary Wall needs to treat the certification process with a lot more respect and dignity. Go back and read the articles in the Pilot that were printed throughout the campaign. Read what he says about getting certified. He continually made a mockery of it and passed it off as not being a big deal. As a former military pilot, you of all people should realize how important such a certification is (whether it's a law enforcement cert or military cert). Also as a former military person, you should realize that the men/women in the military/law enforcement take pride in their certifications. They are symbols of accomplishment and professionalism - do you not believe in that? I'm not saying Gary Wall is against the certification, but he has shown (by publicly stating) that he is not real interested in the process (again, go back and read about it).

In reference to your "cops drive bad" rant, there are those who do that and cops do get killed in accidents. On the other hand, the general public (or civilian population) are much worse. The next time you're out driving in some town or city, just watch the idiots around you. Being former military, as you say, I would think you would have much more respect for the men/women in law enforcement. Sounds to me like you would rather complain about them, call them "mad men on PCP", and generally disrepect their service of putting their necks on the line for the idiots in this world. I wonder if you talk about the men/women in the military the same way? Cops are people too, with kids and families, and life problems just like the rest of us. Show some more respect!

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

Show us some respect, officer, and do your job without putting us in needless danger. Be a good example for others. Drive 65 where the limit is 65 and we'll all get where we're going just about as fast as we would doing 70. Traffic violations by police officers are nothing less than a demonstration that there is a double standard.

I am fully aware that common citizens are the worst drivers of all. Does that make it okay for cops to be second worst?

I seriously doubt that your neck has ever been on the line in the performance of your duties. It makes a good story and sounds all heroic and stuff, but statistically, you've got less than 2 chances in 10,000 of dying on the job (based on 2006 statistics). How many of your peers have died in the line of duty? I knew seven personally who died in aviation incidents during peacetime "training accidents" in a twelve year period. Does that frame it for you a little bit better?

If your neck feels vulnerable, think about something other than retiring after 20 years (which seems to be a major theme I hear when cops chat) and give your family a break so they won't have to worry about you.

One of the RCSO star performers put my neck on the line by somehow "losing" paperwork so that a person summoned to answer for a crime of violence against me walked out of court with his charges dismissed. After trying to see Sheriff Warner about the situation, Dan Taylor later advised me to carry my pistol for protection at my job site in the County, 20 miles from town.

I'd rather deal with an undersheriff who makes sure the papers get to court, certified or not. How's that?

The new guys may not be any better, but they are different, and that means there's a chance things will change. I seriously doubt that lack of instant POST certification on day one of the new job is going to make any big difference in the long run, but if it does, you are free to look for a job elsewhere tomorrow. That's something I couldn't do in the military, and they could put me in jail if I walked away from my job over concern about my "neck."

People are dying in Iraq and Afghanistan to protect your freedom. They cannot quit and go work for UPS in Denver if things get too hot tomorrow. All of this "hero" BS we hear is pretty much designed to pump you guys up to do a dirty job for low pay, but it's your choice to stay on the job. You deal with the bad guys so we don't have to, but fella, there are a lot more of us good guys out there who think you've got a way to go to earn our respect. Clear enough?

I like cops. I support cops. I've had friends and neighbors who are cops. Thank you for what you do for us, and thank you for taking the risks, but the dirty secret among the cops is that Steamboat and Routt County are pretty safe duty.

So there. Have a good day, and be safe out there.

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

You make some good points, but you obviously have a bridge to burn and it's also obvious that you are holding a small grudge towards the police (oh, and I don't work as a cop - I may have read your response wrong, but it seems like you think I am). You are clearly blind to the fact that Routt County/Steamboat Spgs. does have real crime. Domestics are prevalent in this area and they are one of the most dangerous calls police go on - but you say the cops don't put their necks on the line? Yes, this is a fairly safe area, but the dangerous stuff does happen (more often than you think). I have a friend (more of an aquaintence) that works here and has told me numerous stories of the dangerous incidents here in the valley. Do the officers in Steamboat/Routt County put their necks on the line? You bet they do! I thank those men/women for the service they provide, not criticize them as you do. By the way, anyone with half of a brain knows that Steamboat/Routt County is a fairly safe duty (you don't need to be a cop to know that). That doesn't change the fact that bad stuff happens around here and those officers have/do put their necks on the line (again, domestic violence calls happen all the time - read the record or jail bookings in the Pilot, it's all right there for you to see).

The question is not whether Gary Wall feels that he shouldn't obtain his certification, the question is why does he continue to view it as "getting to it when he feels it is appropriate." He made several statements during his campaign that portrayed him as being "above" the certification process (once again, go back and read about it). Gary Wall has failed to show the voters/citizens and his employees that he cares about getting his certification (for goodness sake, it has been printed several times). He doesn't need his certification right this minute, but some positive comments from him regarding the importance of it would be a "nice CHANGE".

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

id04sp- Your comments in your post about 2 in 10,000 dying on the job and how an officer putting his/her neck on the line "sounds all heroic and stuff", well, it's disturbing. Many men/women in law enforcement were in the military. I would think that those people would be ashamed by your comments, especially as a former military person. I would challenge you to go say those things to the family of the Colo Spgs. officers who were killed, yes killed (they were shot), in the line of duty. From articles in the Denver paper, many military personnel turned out to pay their respects for those fallen officers. I don't think you are a bad person and I respect the job you did for our country in the military. You are stating some things, based on what sounds like frustration, but you aren't choosing your words very carefully. Even though you state towards the end of your post that you like and support cops, up until that part you very much sound like someone who doesn't like cops and will criticize those men/women every chance you get.

I actually emailed your posts (and mine) to a good friend of mine who is career military - he just got back from Iraq. He made a very good point and stated that although you served and are entitled to your opinion, it sounded to him like you are bitter about the police. He also stated that he surely doesn't believe that all cops are good (just like military people), but the cops are the men/women who fight the war at home and keep his family safe while he is serving his country. Both he and I disagree with your comments that cops "don't put their necks on the line" (reference your statistic). The cops is this area may not be at as much risk as cops in a big city, but I know the cops around here have been in some pretty dangerous situations, including those situations that posed a threat to their lives.

You should choose your words more carefully, because your fellow military brothers/sisters are now the cops you sound like you are criticizing.

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peabody123 7 years, 3 months ago

Wall won, Wiggins lost. Please support your local sheriff as the saying goes.

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kingsride 7 years, 3 months ago

One reason: Because this is a democracy and the people voted. Ultimately a community gets the type of law enforcement it wants. Thats what happened here.

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

Hmmmm.

I'll put it to you flatly. My comments are based upon my actual contact and experiences with officers of the law. I always believed they were good guys until I had to depend on them to enforce the law. Sometimes they do, and often they do not. Personally, I watch for cops when I'm driving and am aware of situations around me where cops may be involved. True, I can get hit by a civilian, but that's a risk we all take every time we get out on the road.

In general, the officers I've met in the line of duty (like when I hit a deer, when my wife was in a minor accident, when someone I knew invaded my home and began taking things and I called for help rather than SHOOT them, etc.) have been exemplary.

It's the ones who have been negligent or who crash around like cowboys in the patrol vehicles that I'm complaining about. Why don't the REST OF YOU do something about THEM? Oh . . . well, it's because they're, uh, cops and they're, uh, heroes and they, uh, served in Iraq. Dare I raise the possibility that cops don't rat out cops because you've all got SOMETHING on each other?

There's a word. It's called "duty." Some of us understand it, and some of us don't. Duty doesn't stop just because the wrongdoer happens to be a cop.

If you cannot freely perform the duties required with the same standard of law-abiding behavior expected of every other person, you shouldn't be a cop. Nobody owes you a job. It's a choice. You're not a martyr.

There's a reason why I'm not a cop in Colorado Springs. I'm very sorry for the men who died, and for their families, but some jobs come with a risk. Take the risk, or forget the job. That's how it is. The seven men I knew who died fighting the cold war are every bit as dead as those officers, or the people who have died in Iraq. The same sacrifice was made.

According to the statistics I found for 2006, there were 900,000 sworn officers on duty last year. Something like 173 died, and half of those were in traffic accidents. Sorry, but it appears to me that there is just as much chance that a cop will have an accident that may kill a civilian as there is that a cop will be shot in the line of duty. Is there really any difference between a cop killed by a bad guy and a civilian killed accidentally by a cop?

Esplain that one to me, Lucy. I'm all ears.

Yes, cops are human. Yes, they're just people. Yes, we all make mistakes. No, we cannot do without them. Nobody is making them do the job, though. Is it too much to ask them to obey the law and exercise reasonable care and caution where innocent lives are involved? How about just flipping on the lights and sirens on the way up to Rabbit Ears and keeping it down to 40 or so through town so that nobody gets killed? Is that so much to ask?

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ihatestupidpeople 7 years, 3 months ago

id04sp the officers have law as in how fast they can go when threre is a cetain speed limit and it is 15 mph over the posted limit. and how do you know that they are speeding. due you have radar cert and radar in your car. and i one of your comments above you were talking about the CHP what does the caliaforina highway patrol have to do with routt county. if you meant the colorado state patrol then get your facts straight. the colorado state patrol goes through a 6 wk driving school when they are at the acameady, they also get awards when they go 400,000 mile with out and accident and most of them get those, most civilian depts. (ie sspd, rcso, ocpd, hpd) they get awards if they make it 50,000 miles which alot of them dont make it to. so if you are going to start ripping agenices then get your facts right.

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

id04sp- Wow! You are a very bitter person. There are good cops and there are bad cops. There are good military personnel and there are bad military personnel. There are good citizens and there are bad citizens. What's your point? Nobody ever said that cops are being made to do their job, they've chosen that profession and most know that risk is involved. At first, I thought you were making some good points and I agreed with some of them. Per your most recent post, you're just looking to cry about something and it happens to be those "bad cops" you think run crazy all over us poor citizens.

You state that you "watch for cops when driving" and you are "aware of situations around you where cops may be involved". Are you smoking crack or doing something else illegal, because you are one paranoid guy. And as a former military person, your serving in Iraq comment is disgusting. I don't agree with the war at all, but I support our troops 100%. Some of those troops are reservists and work a full time job in the United States as police officers.

I tried to lend an open ear to your comments and even agreed with some of them. However, you have proven to be a disrespectful, ignorant, paranoid, person. If you are so scared about being in an accident with a cop, then don't drive. You are probably one of the morons who doesn't know how to drive anyway. Next time I'm on the road, I'll be looking out for people like you and not the cop driving next to me. And to think, you have the nerve to say that you were former military. How disappointing that you are such a paranoid, disrespectful person who used to serve our country. I hope the next time you have a problem, and need the police, they don't show up. People like you don't deserve that service, because all you do is complain (waaaa!).

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Hmmm 7 years, 3 months ago

Boo- Although we've had our differences, I think your point is excellent. For what it's worth, well said!

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

Okay, Boo, and this time I'm really talking to YOU (not dogd, as I have done by mistake in the past).

Yes, I am aware of what goes on around me because there are a lot of idiots out there. I watch what is happening around my vehicle because I was trained as a military pilot to keep my head on a swivel. If I see blue lights coming in the rear view mirror (because I check it constantly, a habit left over from flying), I assume that there may be a fleeing criminal between me and those lights.

One day last year as I was approaching the left turn to my house off a major road, the traffic ahead of me slowed because someone ahead of me was turning right. It was on a double yellow line. As I started to swing left, with my signal flashing, I checked the outside rear view mirror and saw a jerk in a pickup come out to pass on the double yellow two cars behind me. Apparently, he came up behind the slow line of traffic and was going to pass the whole line between him and the guy ahead who was turning right. Because I was smoking crack and being so paranoid, I was able to hit the brakes and avoid being hit in the driver's door by the guy in the pickup who was passing illegally on the double yellow. The pickup went off the road on our left side, skidded on the shoulder, and avoided hitting me.

So, yeah, you should look out for me and think, "Hey, that guy's being careful and driving safely. I wonder what's up?"

You merely reinforce the fact that people who have not served in the military go around with blinders on, heedless of most that happens around them. They fail to watch out for themselves, and then hire a lawyer to sue the other guy instead of simply preventing a preventable accident.

Have you ever seen what happens to a kid who walks into a propeller on an aircraft carrier flight deck? If you had, you might also be more aware of what goes on around you. It's pretty easy once you get the hang of us. It takes very little effort, and it can save your life. You might want to try it.

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

Boo,

All you yokels are pretty much interchangeable and I just frankly don't take the time or trouble to sort it out sometimes.

No, the truth is that my original response started out to you, but the 3000 character limit kicked in and I deleted the top portion to fit it in. My mistakes don't cost the Pilot anything, and ol' Mitch Cantele over there on the right must be quite a fan of mine because I get so many post cards from him.

"Intent" means nothing to the family that loses a loved one. The family of the cop who died knew he was in a dangerous job. The civilian who dies by accident in a wreck with a cop driving like a maniac is a victim of negligence. There is no crime on the face of the Earth, including murder, that justifies the death of an innocent person caught in the middle by a pursuing cop.

Check the link to see what the cops themselves are saying about it.

http://www.policedriving.com/article201.htm

For the lazy, the article mentions that only a "handful" of states keep statistics on it, but approximately 40% of police pursuits result in a crash. Officers involved in those crashes generally regret them and would do something different the next time. The gist is that most who flee to avoid arrest are petty criminals and no danger to the general public would result from letting them go. Some departments only allow high speed pursuit when the driver is known to be a violent felon who is likely to cause injury to innocent people if he is allowed to escape.

Anybody trying to escape from Routt County in a vehicle is going to be easy for the CSP or the cops in the next town to cut off and apprehend. When was the last time somebody got away? Never?

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Matthew Stoddard 7 years, 3 months ago

I wonder: Is GW is out there tonight pulling people out of ditches? I know our security company is dealing with people in ditches around some of our properties.

OOOOOohhhhhhh wait: they aren't out in the county...just like GW's future office. Still, since the City voted him in an not the County in general, he should hold true to his pledge to help.

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id04sp 7 years, 3 months ago

Kielbasa,

Thanks to the legal community, it's probably not possible for the RCSO to actually pull anybody out of a ditch. If they damage someone's car, they'd be liable.

What if a cop hurt his back hooking up a tow chain? I know a cop who spent his last eight years of duty in the office or out on disability because he hurt his back trying to catch a falling typewriter in the police station after two other cops scuffling with each other fell into a file cabinet where the old Selectric was stored on top.

Consider this: Since half of the county population lives in the city limits, maybe that's a good place for Wall to be.

Seriously, let's give him a few weeks to get going, and then suggest that Wall establish substations out in the county.

The fire station in Clark would be a great spot, and would reduce response time to North Routt from 40 minutes to no more than 20. A patrol vehicle parked there would also be extra protection in the 30 mph zone around Clark when touristas are rushing up and down from Steamboat Lake. There are people walking on that section of CR-129 at all times of day and night.

What about putting a substation in the new convenience store down in Stagecoach, too?

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Matthew Stoddard 7 years, 3 months ago

ID- Being facetious. Making fun of campaign "promises."

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